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China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

wsj.com

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Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#121

Post by masklinn »

stevefan1999 wrote: post #86
paganel wrote: post #85

Why don't we bring trolleybuses back? They rock! You don't need polluting batteries in order to run them, just some copper to put the wires up, and we've been master of this "technology" for almost a century now. Also, we should extend or re-introduce the tram network.

They required overhead transmission wire planning as well, but I do agree we should overhaul trams that we use it to satisfy the need of short distance and constant location travel.

Also recent trolley generations can be equipped with batteries which get charged while connected to the overhead transmission network (or opportunistically at bus stops), allowing some operations on non-wired segments.

Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#122

Post by gpvos »

emptyfile wrote: post #108
elorant wrote: post #87

We have electric buses in Greece since the mid 50s. The key difference with modern era buses is that they don't work with batteries but rely on an infrastructure of aerial power lines to which they connect with two antennas protruding from the top of the vehicle. One thing I remember from whenever I was on board them is how damn slow they move. Occasionally the antennas will disconnect which means the driver will has…

Different thing from a true electric bus.

I'd say they're truer (but I see what you mean).

Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#124

Post by gumby »

paganel wrote: post #85

Why don't we bring trolleybuses back? They rock! You don't need polluting batteries in order to run them, just some copper to put the wires up, and we've been master of this "technology" for almost a century now. Also, we should extend or re-introduce the tram network.

They never went away in US cities like SF and Boston, where they are referred to as “Trackless Trolley”.

Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#125

Post by kalleboo »

iguy wrote: post #119
fiala__ wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They've been in continuous use in Bratislava since the 1940s, and they also have the hybrid ones. They're especially suitable for steep slopes where rail-based transport doesn't work. Absolutely iconic vehicles!

Do the hybrid ones have any clever way to re-connect? All the busses I've seen have this system where the driver has to walk to the back and pull on some rubber bands to put the tentacles back on the wires. If this could be automated, then perhaps you could omit wires at big junctions where it's most messy, needs lots of points, etc. Building & maintaining wires with 90% coverage might cost half as much as 100% cover…

If you search YouTube for “trolleybus automatic” there are a couple of videos. Looks like there are special locations where the catenary has a little plastic guide on it. It also looks quite slow.

Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#126

Post by rcMgD2BwE72F »

benj111 wrote: post #71

So its interesting to think what will happen when they turn their gaze outwards. How long will it take Chinese brands to be a force to be reckoned with? Yes they might be sniffed at to start with, but that's only the same as Japanese cars in the 60s, Skoda in the 90s and most recently Kia, but other manufacturers won't be able to get away with calling them cheap tat for long (assuming they aren't). I assume there are…

>We're all looking at Tesla to bring electric cars to the masses. Should we be looking at China instead?

Right now, Tesla consumes more than 60% of the word EV batteries and their shares is still increasing. I'm sure most of the world's EVs will be Chinese but the most high-end ones will probably be Teslas (made in Shanghai if need be). One can draw a parallel with the smartphones market :)

Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#127

Post by mschuster91 »

antaviana wrote: post #67
marvin wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That type of taxation of externalities is really a no-brainer in the West too, but there’s just not democratic majority for implementing it. A tragedy. Tragedy of the commons, really, on a spectacular scale. A general CO2 tax wouldn’t be hard to implement if we were a dictatorship.

This. Just see the "Yellow Vests" riots in France because of the tax raise on fuel.

> Just see the "Yellow Vests" riots in France because of the tax raise on fuel.

Problem with the French protests is that the fuel tax raise didn't take care of poor-ish people.

Most "eco" politics doesn't care about these people either - no matter the country - and that's the reason why Trump and other right-wingers can hate so successfully against anything environmentally-friendly.

Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#128

Post by klohto »

paganel wrote: post #85

Why don't we bring trolleybuses back? They rock! You don't need polluting batteries in order to run them, just some copper to put the wires up, and we've been master of this "technology" for almost a century now. Also, we should extend or re-introduce the tram network.

We still have them in Czechia. I doubt they would go away now.

Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#129

Post by kaybe »

Uhrheber wrote: post #14

I'm glad they do. I always thought, when 1 Billion Chinese will start to drive cars instead of bicycles, we're all toast (literally). It seems, that also the Chinese government knows this, and they're doing the right thing.

It will still be a problem, since the energy has to come from somewhere. Just as our energy use is a problem.

Re: China ‘Is the Only One in the Race’ to Make Electric Buses, Taxis and Trucks

#130

Post by rcMgD2BwE72F »

pjc50 wrote: post #75
lolive wrote: post #56

Let's consider hydrogen cars are the next big thing. Is it a good move to go massively towards electric cars? Especially regarding batteries that will have to be massively replaced in 2 years?

> Let's consider hydrogen cars are the next big thing. .. let's not? Where are you getting the hydrogen, and how are you transporting it in the car?

>Where are you getting the hydrogen

Fossil fuels (nat gas, more specifically). Betting on electrolysis to produce hydrogen economically from renewable sources is as fanciful as betting on batteries to be made from renewable materials.

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