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A 69-year-old man asks to be declared 49, claiming age is as fluid as gender

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Re: A 69-year-old man asks to be declared 49, claiming age is as fluid as gender

#41

Post by rectang »

dschuetz wrote: post #38
rectang wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not trans, but I am acquainted with many trans people including an awesome past colleague. So take this for what it's worth from another person doing their best to understand gender dysphoria. Imagine that you were to wake up and find yourself in the body of the opposite gender, yet with your sense of attraction and your personal identity unchanged. Wouldn't many of your mannerisms seem awkward to you and to othe…

An interesting question. Why would it seem awkward though? I have mannerism that always did seem different to others which didn't bother me much, even when I was being bullied for that. Why am I different, just because I refuse to modify my mannerism, or modify others to accept that? Lacking the guts, or the strenght to stand up to bullies is not easy. But it should prevent any further damage to one's personality or…

> Self-acceptance is crucial.

However laudable, is that not an ethic rather than an objective assessment? I don't see why that should make us doubt the voices of trans individuals as they describe their situation, even if we might wish for them to achieve self-acceptance.

> I suspect that what you call gender dysphoria isn't the prime cause.

That's not my terminology; it belongs to the medical establishment.

https://www.psychiatry.org/patients-families/gender-dysphori...

It seems to me like you have idiosyncratic experiences, which are perhaps very interesting, but may not apply well to the lives of trans people.

Re: A 69-year-old man asks to be declared 49, claiming age is as fluid as gender

#42

Post by bliblah »

dschuetz wrote: post #16

He's obviously trolling, but he does have a point. If gender is fluid why is it so important for trans people to look like women, or men? Is it a necessity? Then why adopt distinct male or female features, genitalia which do not work as intended? So, is it just cosmetic? Then why are they modifying their bodies? Just to feel well and free? Same goes for this guy. He's feeling like he's much younger than he actually i…

You are conflating gender with sex

>Sex is mechanical

Male species use sperm to impregnate female eggs

>Gender is a social construct

What do you consider "Manly" or "Feminine"?

I really dislike that 99% of all conversations would end if people just phrased it like this. Since a lot of trans people just want to be treated as a member of the opposite gender.

"Age" is also very much a construct since I could use different calendars and have different birthdays to mark my age. But your cells definitely have a limited lifespan which is what most people care about when they talk about age.

Re: A 69-year-old man asks to be declared 49, claiming age is as fluid as gender

#43

Post by dschuetz »

dragonwriter wrote: post #40
dschuetz wrote: post #16

He's obviously trolling, but he does have a point. If gender is fluid why is it so important for trans people to look like women, or men? Is it a necessity? Then why adopt distinct male or female features, genitalia which do not work as intended? So, is it just cosmetic? Then why are they modifying their bodies? Just to feel well and free? Same goes for this guy. He's feeling like he's much younger than he actually i…

> If gender is fluid why is it so important for trans people to look like women, or men? Fluid gender (identity; ascribed gender is externally imposed and to the extent it is or is not fluid, that's on society not the person to whom gender is ascribed) is an aspect of some people's gender identity, it is not something people (at least, many people) believe is inherent with all gender identity. Many trans people have…

But talking to people in person about their emotions and feelings is important! It's very hard, I agree, but it's a necesserary thing dealing with issues. You have to speak out things, to actually voice them. Whence you are confident enough to voice them to some other person, you can talk about it and make other people better understand it. Just writing up some article full of technical and medical terms just doesn't do it.

Re: A 69-year-old man asks to be declared 49, claiming age is as fluid as gender

#44

Post by Theory5 »

eesmith wrote: post #28
dschuetz wrote: post #16

He's obviously trolling, but he does have a point. If gender is fluid why is it so important for trans people to look like women, or men? Is it a necessity? Then why adopt distinct male or female features, genitalia which do not work as intended? So, is it just cosmetic? Then why are they modifying their bodies? Just to feel well and free? Same goes for this guy. He's feeling like he's much younger than he actually i…

Please don't feel that the best way to figure out what a trans person feels like is to find one and ask them. Why do you think they want to educate a stranger? Instead, read one of the many, many articles on this topic. Written by trans people or trans-friendly people who specifically do want to educate strangers. Here's a "Q&A as a trans advocate’s nuanced perspective on Trans 101 questions." - http://www.transadvoc…

I'd agree with the others, the best way to learn is to ask. But you can't just start pestering people, though simply telling them during a conversation that you have questions and are curious has always been the way to go for me. And as long as you're not judgemental and keep an open mind, its informative AND interesting!

Like one trans woman I used to play video games with told me she wanted breasts, vocal cord surgery, BUT didn't want to change her other genitals. In her words "[my penis] is one of the few parts of my body I'm comfortable with"! Before I talked to her, i always assumed trans wanted to obtain ALL changes associated with their desired gender!

Re: A 69-year-old man asks to be declared 49, claiming age is as fluid as gender

#46

Post by Overtonwindow »

The transgender issue has essentially broken science by grossly politicizing it. I think people should be allowed to live and choose whatever labels they want, even though my personal opinion is that there are only two genders. I think if the law is going to allow someone to change their gender, then age and race should be also on the table. If gender, which is supported by hard science, is flexible then what isn’t? We have to make a decision between personal freedom and science.

Re: A 69-year-old man asks to be declared 49, claiming age is as fluid as gender

#47

Post by Falling3 »

dschuetz wrote: post #31
eesmith wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can blame you for not making an effort to read the many articles about trans people and their views. You may not know any Nobel Prize winners, but there sure are a lot of books about them you could read, which would give an idea of what's going on their heads.

I prefer talking, thanks.

If you refuse to seek out the information that's out there because it's not your preferred means of learning - then, yes, they can blame you for not understanding what's in their heads.

Re: A 69-year-old man asks to be declared 49, claiming age is as fluid as gender

#48

Post by eesmith »

dschuetz wrote: post #35
eesmith wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The trans people of the world are not your personal tutors! If you don't even care enough to read the basics, why should they think that you care enough to really understand them? And there are writings from untold thousands of trans people, with different views, so it's not like reading will only give you generalizations. You'll get thousands of specifics.

Whatever happened to talking about personal issues. You really don't get it, do you?

I know that in order to talk to someone you need to learn the language.

Otherwise you're the stereotype of an English speaker going to a foreign country and insisting that people can understand you if you JUST TALK LOUDER.

You don't even seem to be doing the equivalent of picking up a tourist book containing a few phrases to say.

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