I think people forget this cuts both ways there is trade imbalance between US and France in France's favor so if both sides apply similar measures it will be net loss for France.
I am sure this is something politicians forget to mention.
Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
221–230 of 324 posts
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#222Earlier quoted context omitted.
You totally underestimate the governement ability to understand things.
They have a background, a history. They’ve spent the last 40 years adding layer upon layer of tax and subvention mechanism to try to regulate the economy while solving zero fundamental issues ( unemployment, industry, global private sector attractivness, education and recently even healthcare). The only thing they’ve managed to do is to increase the cost of the public sector. So yes, indeed i don’t have any kind of t…
This is idiotic. No one gets educated in France? You have no roads? No police? Nothing? It might not be optimal, but to decry the public service for achieving nothing is really wrong headed.
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#223Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ireland have already been given some lucky charms by the EU. For example, they were given permission to set their corporate taxes to a ridiculously low 12.5%.
Permission? Lucky them having to ask permission to set their own tax policy.
- "p̶e̶r̶m̶i̶s̶s̶i̶o̶n̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶s̶e̶t̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶i̶r̶ ̶o̶w̶n̶ ̶t̶a̶x̶ ̶p̶o̶l̶i̶c̶y̶"
+ "permission to screw over the other countries they're in economic union with by acting as a tax haven for transactions that occur in those other countries"
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#224Earlier quoted context omitted.
The flip side of this argument is that the companies are ripping the countries off by using myriad tax loopholes, because they can. I find it interesting that the companies are often portrayed as smart for doing this, but politicians are jealous and incompetent. Almost like we worship businesses and malign government. I wonder whose interests that viewpoint supports.
>but politicians are jealous and incompetent ...well they did create these tax loopholes in the first place. That’s pretty much the definition of incompetence. So are you arguing that corporations should pay more tax than they are legally required as a gift of charity to countries? If so, how much? What if a competitor decides to pay less?
Corporates likely helped shape those loopholes, and viciously fought the legislation the entire way. Let's not pretend these corps are innocent victims here.
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#225Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm from the US. You could just replace France with the name of my state in your comment and it would hold. We don't even have scooters yet and they're talking about passing regulation in case it becomes a thing. Some places are really used to using regulation to (attempt to) solve problems and when you've been swinging a hammer for the past several centuries it doesn't really matter whether the nails you think you'r…
So what you're saying is, we shouldn't use laws to fix things?
I don't think that's what's being said. (Perhaps I'm wrong.) The gist I'm getting is, just because you have a hammer doesn't mean everything is a nail. And that yesterday's nail might not be today's nail.
The prevailing issue being, politicians - under the false pretense that they paid to be "leaders" (read: look at me! look at what I can do!!) instead of problem solvers - grab their hammer and do what they already do...pound away.
How's that working out for us?
Note: I'm not suggesting a solution per se. Simply acknowledging that we have a problem, and the general nature of that problem.
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#226Earlier quoted context omitted.
AFAIK Vat is a tax which insist on consumers, not on companies.
So an oil company that buys steel pipe to make an oil well doesn't pay VAT on the pipe? Not a European, so just asking.
Either it pays the VAT and gets an equal tax credit, or it doesn't pay it at all (when applying reverse charge).
Result is the same, VAT is not a cost for enteprises.
Obviously the fact that end consumers pay VAT might disincentivise them to buy stuff, so companies still suffer the effects of high VAT rates.
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#227Please correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the sole reason multinational corporations can avoid paying taxes, that they “have to” pay surprisingly large royalties to some sister company in a tax haven that “owns” all the rights to the mother company’s trademarks and other IP? Isn’t this the reason that a company like Google mysteriously isn’t able to turn a profit in most European countries? And if I’m right, couldn’t…
But they should be able to pay something to sister or parent company because they actually use the software developed there. The question is how much. Probably not all of the profits. I guess it's really hard to determine and define strict and fair rules in this area.
It is rather likely that the intellectual property for the google or Starbucks brand or the work that led to Pfizer patents etc were not developed in Bermuda, Bahamas or Panama. It’s hard to exactly apportion where but rather easy to point out that near-zero IP work was done where it was declared to be taxable.
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#228Earlier quoted context omitted.
Everybody pays tax. The issue is that some companies avoid paying it in the EU, basically stealing from the EU citizens. The difference between the taxes and tariffs is that the tariffs target a specific country while the tax is same for everyone (working in a specific industry). Tech companies seems to be the most notorious tax evaders so this was just a push to make them pay a fair share of tax in the EU. >> Tradit…
I agree that tech companies do not pay their fair share of tax. But this is an EU tariff against US companies. Will any EU company be affected?
What makes you think that EU companies are not "affected"? The tax is not on foreign companies thus is not a tariff. It's just a way to make the tax avoidance companies pay some tax.
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#229Earlier quoted context omitted.
> France and Germany take endless steps to protect their domestic economic interests It's not even that in this case, because it's not like there are serious European competitors to these companies (except maybe the odd Samwer clone here and there) that could even be protected. This is purely an attempt to rip these companies off, because the governments can.
The flip side of this argument is that the companies are ripping the countries off by using myriad tax loopholes, because they can. I find it interesting that the companies are often portrayed as smart for doing this, but politicians are jealous and incompetent. Almost like we worship businesses and malign government. I wonder whose interests that viewpoint supports.
I think many people here believe the correct thing for politicians to do would be focusing on making their own countries more competitive when it comes to having tech giants of their own, and they view regulations or taxes like this as being partially the result of 'sour grapes' that their own countries are less successful in this arena.
Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants
#230Earlier quoted context omitted.
I mean this is a tax problem first and foremost isn't it? The problem being that it's hard for countries to enforce regulations in a virtualized, globalized economy. It's true that it's not just about tax, you also have issues regarding what is and isn't legal in a given country (nazi apology is illegal in France for instance, but good luck enforcing that on the web. Similarly the super harsh "no nudity" rule on amer…
I’m pro europe, but let’s face it, if we can’t get any kind of cooperation between state members regarding taxes, then maybe it’s time to rethink the inside mechanicsm of the union ( which may include restart from scratch with fewer countries). This revenue tax won’t change anything. It’s just ransom, and i hate feeling like my representatives make me look like a lazy thief. I’d even prefer something like what china…
> if we can’t get any kind of cooperation between state members regarding taxes, then maybe it’s time to rethink the inside mechanicsm of the union ( which may include restart from scratch with fewer countries).
The problem is when things require unanimity. It's very hard to get all 28 countries to agree to something.