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America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

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Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#231

Post by jimjansen »

ransom1538 wrote: post #82
firedrakerage wrote: post #11

I do not typically post, but these suggestions seem like genuine improvements to the existing system: "Kerr suggests allocating H-1Bs not by lottery as they are now, but by salary — the more that a company is willing to pay for a foreign worker, the quicker they can get a visa." "A second change would be to allow H-1B workers to apply for permanent residency green cards on their own, without having to be sponsored by…

I just wish it was reciprocated. I would like to work in Spain (no really). If I work in Spain, the US should open a spot for someone from Spain to work in the US. You want to hire someone from Turkey? No problem, find someone in the US to move to Turkey. You could allow companies to even grease the wheels, "Work from Turkey and get a 30k / year extra free bonus stipend!! yay!!"

That's lunacy. How many Americans can you find that want to work in Africa, or India or China?

Its going to be a infinitesimally small fraction compared to the number of people from those regions that want to work here.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#232

Post by stale2002 »

jki275 wrote: post #93
QuercusMax wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, didn't realize this was a comedy site. Speaking from personal experience, the number of people with multiple years of experience and multiple degrees in CS (usually BS and MS) who can't pass FizzBuzz is really high .

That's amazing to me. Not arguing you're wrong, I'm not interviewing people, just amazes me that anyone with degrees in CS would not be able to solve such a basic problem.

Well, it is a little bit more complicated than that.

I am sure that any CS major couos write fizz buzz, on their computer, for the purpose of their homework assignment or whatever.

Whether or not they can do the same thing, in 15 minutes, on a whiteboard in front of someone is a different story.

The moral of this story is that writing code, on a blank slate, while having to have all the syntax memorized, and having everything conpile without having access to a compiler, is a real skill that many people haven't even attempted to do.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#233

Post by brandonmenc »

thrmsforbfast wrote: post #76
bduerst wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that pay isn't uniform across skilled labor demand, and the purpose of the H1B program is to fulfill demand in the economy. If you set a quota and give to the highest bidder, you're going to see private sector executives and financial roles being filled in cities with high costs of living and competitive wages. Salary is a function not only of demand but also location and industry. This will discrimina…

> If you set a quota and give to the highest bidder, you're going to see private sector executives, lawyers, and financial roles being filled in cities with high costs of living and competitive wages. Yes, that's the point. Skilled labor immigration is for skilled labor . It should not by a subsidy to companies that cannot afford to pay prevailing wages and/or are unwilling to invest in their workforce. > This will d…

> Middle America will be fine; Chicago, KC, Pittsburgh, etc. can and do compete with the coasts for skilled labor!

These cities may as well be "coastal" relative to their regions. There are a lot of hurting small PA towns less than 100 miles away from Pittsburgh experiencing a brain drain, for example.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#234

Post by bobthechef »

dudul wrote: post #41
sbr464 wrote: post #21

A side benefit that I hadn’t really considered but seems obvious; By taking in skilled workers from other countries, it’s like poaching talent from another company. Then they aren’t contributing to or building companies in their former country. Not sure the scale you would need to make a dent, but is there a name for this?

The choice of word is interesting: encouraging immigration of skilled workers to the US has the benefit of preventing them from participating in the development of their home country. Short term, sure it's beneficial for the US, but I don't think it's a good idea to reflect in a vacuum or only thinking short term. Emergent countries being able to develop is beneficial for everybody.

National (or oligarchical) competition is far from dead, despite the vacuous, maudlin bromides about global unity that will never be true. Why would you expect the US (or anyone else) not to drain other countries of their workers if it suits them? The emphasis is on "if". South Korea was transformed from a backwards rice farming country into a financially prosperous one not by draining Korea of Koreans, but in no small part because it was in the US's interest.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#235

Post by ddingus »

CodeMage wrote: post #226
firedrakerage wrote: post #11

I do not typically post, but these suggestions seem like genuine improvements to the existing system: "Kerr suggests allocating H-1Bs not by lottery as they are now, but by salary — the more that a company is willing to pay for a foreign worker, the quicker they can get a visa." "A second change would be to allow H-1B workers to apply for permanent residency green cards on their own, without having to be sponsored by…

> Both of these would ensure that we can get smart and talented individuals from outside the US and would drastically improve the ability for the US to compete while continuing to provide broad-based wage increases. As an immigrant, I'm all for better and easier immigration system. As a parent of an 11 year old, I can tell you that what your country really needs is not more smart and talented immigrants, but better e…

You are spot on.

Used to be, at least in my region of the USA, companies made local investments to build the talent pool needed.

Tektronix is a stellar example.

https://watch.opb.org/video/oregon-experience-the-spirit-of-...

People literally walked in off the street, got jobs, got education and went on to do great things.

It costs more to do that, but the benefits are easily seen.

Today, we see much less, and demand for people, largely from places that do continue to invest in people, has grown dramatically.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#236

Post by duxup »

dx87 wrote: post #86
duxup wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I always thought H1B should simply be $100k or $120k+ plus jobs only. I was looking through online records and found folks being brought in for sub 50k jobs that looked like low level ... customer service roles.

That's what I thought too, then I saw my company use an H1B to fill a junior web developer job at 70k in the DC/Metro area, which is basically the area's going rate for a 0 experience, straight out of college software developer.

Man, if someone needs an entry level web dev fast... there are so many bootcampers available. Granted the quality varies wildly (I'm a bootcamper myself, I know those people) but they are easily found.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#237

Post by shados »

geff82 wrote: post #203
dunpeal wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correct me if I'm wrong, a friend of mine who looked into it, all he could get in Berlin was less than half his American salary, while his taxes were very substantially higher. His take-home would have been slashed by about 70%, so he gave up the idea. Have things changed since then?

Berlin is the worst place if you want to have a good paying job. If you only want to work for startups, then Berlin is the place to go. But if you are open to work in Big Enterprise IT, then there are many places where you can work and earn very good salaries (especially Frankfurt, Munich, Hamburg where Enterprise IT usually pays between 80k$-140k$ depending on your role). While taxes and contributions for singles ar…

> 80k$-140k$

Thats the problem. You used the dollar symbol, but even if its euros, the upper range you gave is 160k. That's way, way too low for an upper range if someone's thinking of salaries on one of the US' coasts (especially west, but also east). Insurance is mostly for if you lose your job...as long as you have one, its a pretty tiny part of the paychecks, retirement matching is pretty common, food isn't that expense (I dunno about Germany, but compared to other countries Ive lived in, its cheap). After the difference in taxes, the delta in the upper range is a significant factor.

Im curious about the property taxes part though. Do you have some examples? Real numbers are hard to google.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#238

Post by cwperkins »

As when any immigration topic comes up on here, I am in full support of getting the best talent from anywhere in the world to help create the next innovation or invention that makes people lives easier, better and richer. I just ask, because I know there are many immigrants on this forum, that if the American people are given a referendum on what they think is proper on how to handle immigration (whether it be legal or illegal) that you respect the vote of the electorate. With that being said I wish anyone that wants to immigrate to America has a good experience with the people here, works hard and achieves the American dream for themselves and their offspring.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#239

Post by bduerst »

thrmsforbfast wrote: post #181
lmkg wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As for rural America, there's a reason these areas > can't attract companies or talent. Look, I don't want to live in a remote shit-hole either, but... The fact that the concerns of rural communities are summarily dismissed when making policy was one of the big contributing factors to the election victories of both Brexit and Trump. (Possibly more due to resentment rather than as a rational response, but that's irr…

> The fact that the concerns of rural communities are summarily dismissed when making policy was one of the big contributing factors to the election victories of both Brexit and Trump Do you think that an influx of underpaid skilled labor is going to ease the tensions that created Brexit and Trump? Your assertion here appears to be that Trump voters were pissed off that more immigrants weren't making it to their home…

>underpaid skilled labor

H1B visas are only granted to people who are paid more than the prevailing wages of citizens working the same SOC code job in the same area. There have been consultancies in the past who have gamed this, but USCIS has cracked down severely on this in the past year or so.

Re: America’s Need for Skilled Immigrants Isn’t Going Away

#240

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

tabtab wrote: post #146

The H-1B topic strikes a personal tone with me. After the dot-com crash in the early 2000's, IT jobs in California were hard to come by. I almost got one job, but the company decided to go with an H-1B worker instead. I had a new young family, but had to go out of state to find work, leaving my family behind. I'm NOT summarily against H-1B's but wish to insist they be used ONLY to fill in true skill shortages instead…

> I almost got one job, but the company decided to go with an H-1B worker instead.

This scenario is explicitly forbidden by the provisions of the visa program and it is illegal to select a guest worker in preference to a domestic candidate. That is why there is a public notification requirement for all jobs open to guest workers. Obviously all it takes is one minor reason to deem you unqualified. The Disney IT incident shows that there are no consequences for abusing American employees.

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