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Who Are My Investors?

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Re: Who Are My Investors?

#181

Post by AnthonyMouse »

richardknop wrote: post #172
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Pretty much every single comment so far is cynical. "No one really wants to know how the sausage is made", lots of money is tainted anyway, it's just PR fluff, etc etc. It seems like a deeper problem than that, which is that money is fungible. It's the same thing as saying we shouldn't buy Saudi oil. If the only result is that you buy some other oil and the people who would have bought that oil buy the Saudi oil, n…

> It's the same thing as saying we shouldn't buy Saudi oil. If the only result is that you buy some other oil and the people who would have bought that oil buy the Saudi oil, nothing meaningful has changed. I'm not sure this is true for oil. For example, long standing sanctions against Iran prevented them from selling a lot of their oil and crippled their economy quite a lot (decreasing their income). The same could…

> I'm not sure this is true for oil. For example, long standing sanctions against Iran prevented them from selling a lot of their oil and crippled their economy quite a lot (decreasing their income).

You're referring to international sanctions (i.e. acting with market power), not something anyone can do at the individual level. Not even the US could do it on their own -- if the US put sanctions on Iran by itself, Iran would just sell to Europe or Asia and not care. The only way it works is if nearly everyone agrees not to buy from them.

But the reason countries don't like sanctions on oil exporting countries isn't that they're ineffective, it's that they raise oil prices.

> Oil would come from other countries, they could increase their output while Saudis are under sanctions.

Yes it would, that's normal for a commodity market. When you remove a supplier, the price increases, which attracts new suppliers who may have higher production costs.

But the relevant part of that dynamic is that the price increases. The problem isn't that oil becomes unavailable, it's that your consumers have to pay more for it and the money goes to other countries you don't really want to enrich.

And if you have an international coalition willing to suffer higher oil prices then the much better alternative is a carbon tax, because then you get the money from the higher prices instead of Russia and OPEC, and can use it for things like subsidizing renewable energy or electric cars to mitigate the cost to your consumers and reduce the length of time you have to pay it.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#182

Post by nicolas_t »

roenxi wrote: post #179
readhn wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the same could be said about a lot of dictators. these guys make it so that there is no other option (by killing opponents) for the country.

Obviously a functional democratic society will stomp a dictatorial one on pretty much any axis you care to think of. Having acknowledged that central point, we can't just say "dictators are bad". We can say "democracy is better", but there are instances where democracy doesn't work. For a realpolitic example, great powers have a long history of quietly corrupting and overthrowing democracies where their interests con…

> Obviously a functional democratic society will stomp a dictatorial one on pretty much any axis you care to think of.

A lot of Singaporeans might disagree there. Enlightened dictatorship can be really good however the probability of a having a great dictator is extremely low.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#183

Post by AnthonyMouse »

richardknop wrote: post #175
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Saudi Arabia is a counter example to your point: Iran has a considerable amount of oil but because of unrelated geopolitical circumstances, it can't easily sell that to the global market like KSA can. That imbalance has little to do the nature of oil and a lot to do with the KSA-United States' petrodollar and arms deals. It has little to do with oil and much to do with Trump making the Iran deal a campaign issue an…

Trump is not an important player in this saga (yet, maybe after 2 full terms, if he would get reelected, he will have more of an impact). Iran has been sanctioned and prevented from selling their oil to global markets easily (thus crippling Iran's income and economy) for a long time before Trump and through multiple presidents from both parties. Sure, Trump made the Iran deal a campaign issue but this goes decades ba…

Trump is clearly the impetus behind the current international sanctions. They had previously been removed by the UN under the Iran nuclear deal in 2016.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#184

Post by sdrothrock »

roenxi wrote: post #179
readhn wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the same could be said about a lot of dictators. these guys make it so that there is no other option (by killing opponents) for the country.

Obviously a functional democratic society will stomp a dictatorial one on pretty much any axis you care to think of. Having acknowledged that central point, we can't just say "dictators are bad". We can say "democracy is better", but there are instances where democracy doesn't work. For a realpolitic example, great powers have a long history of quietly corrupting and overthrowing democracies where their interests con…

> We can say "democracy is better", but there are instances where democracy doesn't work.

Just a book recommendation, but for people interested in learning more about these kinds of situations, I'd really recommend Amy Chua's "World on Fire."

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#185

Post by richardknop »

BeetleB wrote: post #177
richardknop wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Saudis are not known as people who kill in other countries. What about Yemen? What about so many extremist Islamist organisations having roots in Saudi Arabia? The 9/11 highjackers, Muslim Brotherhood, funding and military support Saudis give to "rebels" in Syria and Libya?

I'm really not sure what you're trying to say. The killing of the journalist is nothing like all the other things you mentioned - and some are so broad it's almost like saying "Saudi Arabia is a country with an intelligence arm." It again is a case of the opposite Halo effect. Because an entity is evil in many ways, are we just going to assume they're evil in any way we like?

The parent post said Saudis are not known for killing in other countries. I gave examples of Saudis either directly killing in other countries (Yemen bombing which is very controversial) or funding / helping extremist groups that kill in other countries.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#186

Post by timavr »

Not naming LPs and stating that they are awesome is just using your influence to whitelist market participants and is very self-serving.

Large pension funds have a lot of problems too, like embezzlement/corruption/failing fiduciary duties.

So it is pretty binary, either you are transparent or you are not. And if you are not, claiming that you are better then others, is just marketing.

It is pretty low to use someone tragic death to score some cheap deal flow points.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#187

Post by richardknop »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #181
richardknop wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's the same thing as saying we shouldn't buy Saudi oil. If the only result is that you buy some other oil and the people who would have bought that oil buy the Saudi oil, nothing meaningful has changed. I'm not sure this is true for oil. For example, long standing sanctions against Iran prevented them from selling a lot of their oil and crippled their economy quite a lot (decreasing their income). The same could…

> I'm not sure this is true for oil. For example, long standing sanctions against Iran prevented them from selling a lot of their oil and crippled their economy quite a lot (decreasing their income). You're referring to international sanctions (i.e. acting with market power), not something anyone can do at the individual level. Not even the US could do it on their own -- if the US put sanctions on Iran by itself, Ira…

> But the relevant part of that dynamic is that the price increases. The problem isn't that oil becomes unavailable, it's that your consumers have to pay more for it and the money goes to other countries you don't really want to enrich.

Perhaps. But I remember there being very high oil prices (way over $100 per barrel) not that long ago. And there were actually less sanctions on oil countries during the time of such high oil prices.

So I'd question whether the market price discovery works for oil prices very well. It could as well be manipulated by OPEC cartel. I have read articles about Saudis lowering oil price by increasing output because they wanted to put pressure on US shale oil companies to put them out of business.

Oil price has been slowly creeping up again so perhaps the cartel has decided to increase the price.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#188

Post by hkyeti »

rajekas wrote: post #141

I am several standard deviations to the left of Fred Wilson, but I can't fathom why his decision is being greeted with so much negativity. He might have taken dodgy money at some point (but he's willing to acknowledge it) and now he's big enough to screen his LPs but he still didn't have to write this piece. That he has chosen to do so is a sign of progress. Let's give credit where it's due. As a vegan, I want the wo…

Agree, too often we appeal to futility to justify (subconsciously) doing nothing... there's a lot we can do, and most impacts follow a power law curve

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#189

Post by ddeck »

howlgram wrote: post #162
readhn wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the same could be said about a lot of dictators. these guys make it so that there is no other option (by killing opponents) for the country.

>by killing opponents Gaddafi's rise to power was a bloodless Coup [1], from the little understanding that I have, he was beloved by many Libyans, you should question where these "militias" that took him down came from, his dying words were 'What did I do to you?' [2], and you should question for what reasons should he be considered "tyrannical". Should you look at Libya today, it is ran by territorial gangs, which i…

Although he was never tried, the sheer number of witnesses detailing his systematic rape of young girls, murder of opponents and starvation of civilians for example, lends a lot of credibility to him being very much tyrannical.

A few summaries:

"Victims and witnesses state in the documentary that Gadhafi would choose his targets on visits to schools or colleges, patting on the head those who caught his eye.

His security officials would then take the victim to one of several specially designed suites of rooms, where they would be abused and raped by the dictator. In one such suite at Tripoli University, there is a fully-equipped gynecological examination room, where victims were tested for sexually transmitted diseases before being sexually abused.

"Some were only 14," recalled one teacher at a Tripoli school. "They would simply take the girl they wanted. They had no conscience, no morals, not an iota of mercy, even though she was a mere child."

Some of the girls were held for years, while others were dumped with appalling injuries."

"The women would first be raped by the dictator then passed on, like used objects, to one of his sons and eventually to high-ranking officials for more abuse," said Benghazi-based psychologist Seham Sergewa, who interviewed victims for the International Criminal Court.

https://www.haaretz.com/gadhafi-s-crimes-revealed-1.5315653

"Gaddafi had a harem of women kept in the basement of his residence, in little rooms or apartments. These women, obligated to appear before him in their underwear, could be called at any time of day or night. They were raped, beaten, subjected to the worst kinds of sexual humiliation. For Gaddafi, rape was a weapon … a way of dominating others -- women, obviously, because it was easy, but also men, by possessing their wives and daughters."

https://www.france24.com/en/20120920-muammar-gaddafi-rape-we...

"One document shows the commanding general of government forces instructing his units to starve Misrata's population during the four-month siege."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/jun/18/muammar-gaddaf...

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#190

Post by richardknop »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #183
richardknop wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump is not an important player in this saga (yet, maybe after 2 full terms, if he would get reelected, he will have more of an impact). Iran has been sanctioned and prevented from selling their oil to global markets easily (thus crippling Iran's income and economy) for a long time before Trump and through multiple presidents from both parties. Sure, Trump made the Iran deal a campaign issue but this goes decades ba…

Trump is clearly the impetus behind the current international sanctions. They had previously been removed by the UN under the Iran nuclear deal in 2016.

Yes but it is continuation of a long trend that goes back decades and many presidencies. The Obama and Iran deal was a deviation from standard US policy of "Iran bad, Saudis good". So I'm just saying Trump has basically returned to normal US policy on this front, it's not some extreme change of direction.
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