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Who Are My Investors?

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Re: Who Are My Investors?

#151

Post by rpcastagna »

lordnacho wrote: post #110

I've come across this problem a few times when running a hedge fund. To what degree does one care where the money came from, aside from following AML rules? I get the feeling you only write articles like that if you have more people wanting to invest than you have capacity for. - A friend called, asking for a recommendation for a job he was applying for. And advice about whether it was worth taking. Turned out, it wa…

It's weird to me you would treat this state of affairs as a static and universally-holding position. I think it's obvious (with several current examples coming to mind) that investors and business partners can be branded as "toxic" in a way that overwhelmingly devalues any money they could actually offer. In the same way the police will take a stolen watch from you after you buy it -- without much recourse on your part! -- you and your company can definitely be torpedoed by taking bad money if public opinion shifts that sharply.

These are the risks of working at the national and global scale; they have to be there, otherwise the rewards couldn't (sustainably) be so great. Even ignoring the moral arguments, the fact that anybody is making them changes the game theory perspective as well. The only way to truly stay on top is to make sure most people want you there.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#152

Post by AnthonyMouse »

kenneth wrote: post #149
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The distinction you're making matters at the level of individuals. If you're a person choosing a startup to dedicate years of your life to, the choice you make has major consequences for you. At the level of a huge wealth fund, those details are noise that gets canceled out because the more promise a startup has the more capital dollars are chasing it, so the buy in price is proportional to the value. Arguing that in…

I'm a bit confused by the wording, but I think you're trying to say that to a sovereign wealth fund, investment opportunities are essentially fungible because they're allocating their money over a large portfolio. So if one of the big VCs or tech companies won't take their money, another will and in a diversified portfolio that's good enough.

> So if one of the big VCs or tech companies won't take their money, another will and in a diversified portfolio that's good enough.

Right, except that we're talking about smaller companies rather than larger ones, so it's even worse because there are more of them.

Restricting who can own a large publicly traded company which is a part of the major index funds would be... impractical.

Which actually brings up another point. Even if you're selective in who you sell a stake to, what happens when they sell their stake to someone else? Or they themselves get bought out or merge with someone?

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#153

Post by readhn »

howlgram wrote: post #146
lordnacho wrote: post #110

I've come across this problem a few times when running a hedge fund. To what degree does one care where the money came from, aside from following AML rules? I get the feeling you only write articles like that if you have more people wanting to invest than you have capacity for. - A friend called, asking for a recommendation for a job he was applying for. And advice about whether it was worth taking. Turned out, it wa…

I just want to mention that Gaddafi brought a lot of development to Libya and his death did nothing for his people. It's easy to say "oh he was a dictator and dictators are bad" but it's not so simple.

the same could be said about a lot of dictators. these guys make it so that there is no other option (by killing opponents) for the country.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#154

Post by readhn »

Dirty money (drugs, corrupt politicians, gangsters) is THE elephant in the Western Room. Everyone keeps ignoring it as long as the money keeps flowing into real estate, companies/start ups.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#155

Post by statictype »

lordnacho wrote: post #110

I've come across this problem a few times when running a hedge fund. To what degree does one care where the money came from, aside from following AML rules? I get the feeling you only write articles like that if you have more people wanting to invest than you have capacity for. - A friend called, asking for a recommendation for a job he was applying for. And advice about whether it was worth taking. Turned out, it wa…

>And where do you draw the line? What if a benevolent, enlightened, prosperous but essentially a dictatorship state from the equator wants to invest? And they could well claim to be a democracy.

I assume you’re talking about Singapore. Its not inaccurate but I think its not really fair to paint them with the same brush as the others.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#156

Post by mindgam3 »

After 15 years working in Silicon Valley startups, I am as jaded and cynical as they come, but this is really refreshing. A VC making a stand for values, and having the balls to admit that his own hands aren’t entirely clean? Outstanding. We need more conversations about integrity, and more high level players with the integrity to admit that they have been wrong in the past.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#157

Post by tomasien »

statictype wrote: post #155
lordnacho wrote: post #110

I've come across this problem a few times when running a hedge fund. To what degree does one care where the money came from, aside from following AML rules? I get the feeling you only write articles like that if you have more people wanting to invest than you have capacity for. - A friend called, asking for a recommendation for a job he was applying for. And advice about whether it was worth taking. Turned out, it wa…

>And where do you draw the line? What if a benevolent, enlightened, prosperous but essentially a dictatorship state from the equator wants to invest? And they could well claim to be a democracy. I assume you’re talking about Singapore. Its not inaccurate but I think its not really fair to paint them with the same brush as the others.

The commentator is specifically asking where you draw the line and is making that the point that this case seems very different but has some of the same characteristics of the ostensibly more clear-cut cases. OP is specifically saying this is not the same brush.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#158

Post by tomasien »

lordnacho wrote: post #110

I've come across this problem a few times when running a hedge fund. To what degree does one care where the money came from, aside from following AML rules? I get the feeling you only write articles like that if you have more people wanting to invest than you have capacity for. - A friend called, asking for a recommendation for a job he was applying for. And advice about whether it was worth taking. Turned out, it wa…

Good points but "where do you draw the line? It's not clear" is fair observation but not a conclusion. You DO have to draw the line and just because where to draw it isn't clear doesn't absolve you (or anyone!) from drawing it.

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#159

Post by dforrestwilson »

lordnacho wrote: post #110

I've come across this problem a few times when running a hedge fund. To what degree does one care where the money came from, aside from following AML rules? I get the feeling you only write articles like that if you have more people wanting to invest than you have capacity for. - A friend called, asking for a recommendation for a job he was applying for. And advice about whether it was worth taking. Turned out, it wa…

I’m sorry but this is a pathetic cop out.

Just because the financial system is global, it does not mean you have to launder money for drug dealers or other people with shady morals.

“The business needed the investment” is just code for you desiring an X-figure paycheck.

The other corollary of this - should we really be surprised that an anti-globalist like Trump is in power with lax attitudes such as the above?

Re: Who Are My Investors?

#160

Post by tomasien »

dcposch wrote: post #38

Pretty much every single comment so far is cynical. "No one really wants to know how the sausage is made", lots of money is tainted anyway, it's just PR fluff, etc etc. The classic HN Middlebrow Dismissal in full effect. Counterpoint: cynicism is too easy. Actually giving a shit is harder, it's uncomfortable, it involves compromise. Yes, if you refuse investment from any country that has ever violated a human right,…

Exactly! It's not about "tainted" vs. "untainted", it's about setting some limits and trying to be a part of the solution. Doing so puts in progress something that WILL start to shift things. You don't have to be money trail inspector, you just need to be your own ethical link in an otherwise ethically unknown chain.

You're responsible for making a reasonable effort where you think it's important not for the actions of everyone who has ever touched a dollar you're now touching.

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