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You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

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Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#471

Post by kwhitefoot »

acchow wrote: post #32
CryoLogic wrote: post #19

If anyone here has been to Japan, tipping is handled much more elegantly and with a lot more business integrity. Instead of guilt-tripping customers into tipping, businesses in Japan up their prices if they need more money. I remember once when I was in Osaka I was at a really good sushi place that I had visited several times prior. There was no tip option on the receipt (didn't see it anywhere in Japan) and there wa…

My parents didn't know when they went to Japan; they tipped at a restaurant and walked out the door. They were promptly chased down the street and their money handed back to them.

I had the opposite experience in Raleigh, North Carolina. My family and I ate at the ten ten Chinese buffet and when we paid I, as a good European, didn't add a tip, it just never occurred to me and anyway the only service we had received was a waiter slopping pink lemonade into glasses from a jug as he wandered around the tables.

We were chased by an irate waiter asking why I hadn't tipped. So I tipped him a single dollar bill to make it clear how little the service was worth.

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#472

Post by kwhitefoot »

SahAssar wrote: post #464
jstoiko wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can reasonably withhold a tip from someone who is actively hostile or incompetent, but really all you're doing is making yourself feel better. Well, one could argue that this is effectively NOT making you feel better, quite the opposite. Empathy is what makes people feel better. So to counter-argue your point, tipping someone despite the fact you may have negative feelings about their service or judge incompete…

If that's the case for tipping then why aren't all service jobs "tipping jobs"? I mean you wouldn't tip at mcdonalds, right?

And why don't people tip bus drivers, airline check in clerks, the counter staff at Hertz, etc.? Some check out operators in supermarkets are more efficient than others, should they be tipped?

What is it that makes restaurant and bar staff special?

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#473

Post by Symbiote »

snowwrestler wrote: post #391
Udik wrote: post #355

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks, then I'll bring my own waiter.

At a lot of restaurants, you do bring your own waiter. These also tend to be restaurants with no tipping. Think: McDonalds or Subway.

Isn't this exactly what the article is about?

McDonalds and certainly Subway are more effort to the staff than passing over a pre-packed muffin in a coffee shop.

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#474

Post by Symbiote »

tyfon wrote: post #274
spdionis wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the problem the other way around? In Europe taxes are included in the price from the start.

Also, at least here in Norway, the service workers have to pay taxes on the tips. How does this work in other countries? It it just a way to dodge taxes for the owners? Minimum wage laws also applies to the pre-tip salary so it's not really expected most places unless you get exceptional service. I've never seen "pre-calculated" tips either here or elsewhere in Europe.

Some proportion (between 25-75%, I'm not really sure) of restaurants in Britain do this.

At the bottom of the menu it says something like "A discretionary service charge of 10% will be added to your bill [for groups of (4|5|6) or more]"

Then it ends up like this: https://s3-media3.fl.yelpcdn.com/bphoto/28hfOrBSZ1SYPD--tlNU...

I don't like it; it makes the prices on the menu appear smaller than a competing restaurant.

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#475

Post by Symbiote »

late2part wrote: post #351
hesk wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not really obscured. Actual costs and taxes are stated separately on every receipt or invoice. It's just that the advertised price has to include taxes.

Fair point, thanks for clarifying.

Example receipt from Sweden: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9e/Cash_rou...

On the middle one, you can see there are two different tax rates ("MOMS" = VAT), depending on the category of goods.

Here's one from Germany: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/26/Aldi-Qui...

It also has two VAT rates (MwSt A and B), and each item is marked according to the rate. The yoghurt and müsli has a lower rate than the soft drinks and electronics.

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#476

Post by IshKebab »

ghaff wrote: post #278
IshKebab wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not really confusing. Basically, don't tip anywhere except restaurants with table service where you pay at the table after the food. Then it is 10% (unless they did particularly good or bad service). Pay at the bar before receiving food? Don't tip. Buying drinks at a bar? Don't tip. Ordering an Uber? Don't tip. Etc.

Yes, but you're only given the opportunity to add a tip to your credit card some of the time even when a service charge isn't added. I guess you're expected to leave some cash in that case.

No just ignore it.

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#477

Post by mojomark »

dragonwriter wrote: post #438
mojomark wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the muffin just cost 20% more and the untipped barista got paid a higer wage the burdens would still be split the same. That sounds true in principle, but your ignoring the commision aspect of the service. In the tipping model, a very efficient server could, say, serve 100 miffins/hr and be tipped 20% each accordingly. A fast, but rude server could serve 100 muffins, but perhaps get 0-10% tip each sale. A slow,…

> In the tipping model, a very efficient server could, say, serve 100 miffins/hr and be tipped 20% each accordingly. A fast, but rude server could serve 100 muffins, but perhaps get 0-10% tip each sale. A slow, but polite server may only serve 50 muffins, but garner 20% tip each. Well, sure, in some world where tipping actually reflects service and politeness alone, rather than being significantly determined by gende…

All I'm saying is that, while it may not be a perfect system, I like having the the power to judge the quality of service provided to me on a case by case basis.

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#478

Post by Wehrdo »

asdff wrote: post #453
PurpleBoxDragon wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>A very easy, relatively pleasant way to get through life in the US if you're well-off enough that you routinely buy coffee in expensive coffee shops: just always tip. Anywhere there's a tip line. You never have to figure anything out, and sometimes people really appreciate it. This echoes the sentiment that 'if you can't afford to pay a X% tip, you can't afford to buy the product'. Problem is that it seems to keep g…

I find that no one really bothers with the math anymore. If the bill is $11 most people will just put $1.50 or $2.00 rather than work out a fixed percent.

Personally, I feel like if I calculate an exact 15% to the penny, I'm being petty. So I'll typically calculate the exact tip, then round up.

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#479

Post by ghaff »

IshKebab wrote: post #476
ghaff wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but you're only given the opportunity to add a tip to your credit card some of the time even when a service charge isn't added. I guess you're expected to leave some cash in that case.

No just ignore it.

Hence it’s a bit confusing as service charge not included is often printed in big letters in the receipt.

Re: You Want 20% for Handing Me a Muffin? The Awkward Etiquette of iPad Tipping

#480

Post by justin66 »

tedunangst wrote: post #398
justin66 wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It happens all the time. Connie Schultz won a Pulitzer for writing about this, among other things: https://www.pulitzer.org/winners/connie-schultz I can understand why you might think it never happens if you are completely ignorant of the facts on the ground but nevertheless familiar with the criminal and civil sanctions involved. It's about lack of enforcement.

Weird how the proof that owners are pocketing credit card tips is a story about someone stealing cash from the tip jar.

It has been years since I read her series of articles on the topic of tipping, although I remember it being influential at the time. It's possible I linked to the wrong thing, but in my defense I didn't realize that my post would be required to rise to the level of mathematical proof. Ahem.
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