How is this different than simply setting Google's DNS servers on your router or wifi settings ?
Alphabet's cyber unit Jigsaw introduces a new security app to bust censorship
141–148 of 148 posts
Re: Alphabet's cyber unit Jigsaw introduces a new security app to bust censorship
#142Earlier quoted context omitted.
The NSA and USA do not have a recent history of murdering tens of millions of its own citizens. What America does has no effect on the morality of what China does. This is whataboutism at its finest.
Saying “whataboutism” is not a defense for hypocrisy. But I suppose you’re right, the US only murders tens of millions of foreigners.
The USA has not murdered tens of millions of foreigners.
Re: Alphabet's cyber unit Jigsaw introduces a new security app to bust censorship
#143Earlier quoted context omitted.
What America does has no effect on the morality of what China does. This is whataboutism at its finest.
GP was asking how this is different than what the NSA does. The poster above me said it was because China acts on that information, but the US does not. I provided evidence America does act on information. This is perspective.
You're not wrong. The NSA acts on that information, but the comparison is meaningless. America launches targeted attacks on what it believes to be terrorist threats to itself. China murders millions of its own innocent civilians.
Re: Alphabet's cyber unit Jigsaw introduces a new security app to bust censorship
#144Earlier quoted context omitted.
Just a few things: 1) This tool is made by an Alphabet owned company (Jigsaw), not Google, another Alphabet owned company. The companies will have different missions, even if profits flow the same direction. 2) Venezuela doesn't have a huge market where Google is blocked by a nation-wide firewall. 3) China has a nation-wide firewall blocking any Google service, thereby forcing Google to negotiate how their service wo…
>2) Venezuela doesn't have a huge market where Google is blocked by a nation-wide firewall. How is that a justification?
I'm not trying to justify anything, exactly. I'm pointing out that oversimplifying the situation is not helpful.
However, they are different in this case because Venezuela's market isn't large enough that Google feels the need to bend to the will of the government there to be competitive in the world's market. Therefore, they can afford, on a competitive level, to stand against censorship in Venezuela, where doing the same thing in China costs them a huge amount of money. Which is their motivator, as they are a corporation.
Re: Alphabet's cyber unit Jigsaw introduces a new security app to bust censorship
#145Earlier quoted context omitted.
Is there a difference to how the NSA does same albeit with a time delay instead of being instantaneous?
The NSA and USA do not have a recent history of murdering tens of millions of its own citizens. What America does has no effect on the morality of what China does. This is whataboutism at its finest.
Whataboutism wasn’t necessarily the point I intended on making. Rather if Google employees feel morally infringed at the prospect of Dragonfly for reasons described why then do they give a pass to their own state? Of course the USA & China differ vastly on governance but what’s the use of principles if you selectively apply them?
Re: Alphabet's cyber unit Jigsaw introduces a new security app to bust censorship
#146Earlier quoted context omitted.
I guess that’s what the GP was saying. I’m not sure what the alternative is, though - Google could completely pull out of the Chinese market and leave it for competitors like Facebook, Yahoo and MS? Didn’t we go through that already?
To respond to your argument, the same "sitting duck" claim could be made in any case of wrongdoing. You can't steal something just because it is unsecured and likely to be stolen - "His bike wasn't locked, so I took it on the grounds that somebody would probably take it and that somebody might as well be me." Neither the ease of perpetrating the crime nor the number of other criminals in the world are mitigating fact…
We’re talking about business. To many people, those other companies are conducting legitimate business in China, not committing a clearly inexcusable crime, like your example. Google is competition with those companies worldwide, and it could easily be construed by shareholders that their refusal to participate is harming the business. A clear case can be made that choosing to not participate in the largest market in the world for moral reasons is not a good business decision. The comparison you’ve made fits the situation poorly but I’d welcome a better analogy.
Re: Alphabet's cyber unit Jigsaw introduces a new security app to bust censorship
#147Earlier quoted context omitted.
I mean, China's the one censoring it. Google could link to the censored websites in the results but that would be a terrible user experience. Wouldn't it be better to do what they do with DMCA takedowns in the US, where they tell you how many results have been removed and why? And Google already censors search results in the EU with the right to be forgotten, where they've received 41,000 requests from EU politicians…
They also tied every search request with a government ID according to some reports and one must assume they’re willing and able to share that with the Chinese state security. As far as I’m aware the EU isn’t targeting minority citizens for increased surveillance like the Chinese state is doing to the Uighurs either.
>They also tied every search request with a government ID according to some reports
Which ones? I wasn't aware it was even live. Are you talking about Bing, which is already operating in China?
Re: Alphabet's cyber unit Jigsaw introduces a new security app to bust censorship
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
They also tied every search request with a government ID according to some reports and one must assume they’re willing and able to share that with the Chinese state security. As far as I’m aware the EU isn’t targeting minority citizens for increased surveillance like the Chinese state is doing to the Uighurs either.
>They also tied every search request with a government ID according to some reports Which ones? I wasn't aware it was even live. Are you talking about Bing, which is already operating in China?
I wrote in past tense incorrectly, my grammar isn’t so great.
https://theintercept.com/2018/09/14/google-china-prototype-l...