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Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

bloomberg.com

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Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#81

Post by stellar678 »

tormeh wrote: post #68
stellar678 wrote: post #35

They neglected a huge part of the coming electric vehicle picture: lightweight, slow-speed electric vehicles. Almost 60% of US car trips are 5 miles or shorter. (2017 ref: https://nhts.ornl.gov/tables09/ae/work/Job63697.html , 2009 ref: https://nhts.ornl.gov/tables09/fatcat/2009/vt_TRPMILES.html ) Scooters, e-bikes, and electric cargo bikes (not to mention the human-powered versions!) will soak up an enormous portion…

I don't think so. A car is the most outwardly visible status/everything symbol you have. This is important, especially for men without a family. They're not going to want to be seen in a Renault Zoe or a scooter.

I remember back in 2007 when I would try to talk to people about this badass upcoming Tesla Roadster that could smoke supercars. A very common thing I heard was: "Yea that's interesting, but I mean, a silent car is just not cool like a screaming V12."

Times change.

Outward status also comes from travel, clothing, food, lifestyle, and housing choices.

--

The flip side of the equation is that cars (even electric ones) have enormous externalized costs that are not paid by the owner/driver of the car.

As those costs are accounted, the balance will continue to tilt away from cars where they can be avoided. (Particulate pollution from tires, brakes and road surface wear has an enormous public health cost, congestion & long commutes have enormous productivity and health costs, parking and sprawling development have enormous unaccounted infrastructure costs.)

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#82

Post by kasey_junk »

selectodude wrote: post #66
srtjstjsj wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have a car in the city, you should park in your building's parking garage, not in the street. The problem is that residential street parking is overused. In the street, you charge at a meter, the same place you put in your payment. http://www.rolecserv.com/ev-charging/product/EV-Charging-Str...

Unfortunately, my building is over 120 years old. They weren't forward thinking enough with electricity or parking spots, I guess.

I mean they had electric cars when the building was built...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Times-Herald_race

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#83

Post by petre »

Eric_WVGG wrote: post #74
zizee wrote: post #45

I think that electric car adoption is going to have similar characteristics to digital cameras. I remember playing with an early digital camera and seeing a poor replacement for film, but with obvious benefits. Back then it was common to hear "serious" photographers pooh-poohing digital, and how it's many drawbacks would mean it would remain niche, and never replace film. It didn't take long and digial cameras improv…

> "I live in an apartment, I can't charge one, on the street" I agree with pretty much everything you said, but I still can't fathom how electric cars are going to make more than a dent in NYC where most cars are stored streetside.

Unless the municipality installs street size charging stations. Then they can charge for parking and electricity.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#84

Post by mabbo »

Eric_WVGG wrote: post #74
zizee wrote: post #45

I think that electric car adoption is going to have similar characteristics to digital cameras. I remember playing with an early digital camera and seeing a poor replacement for film, but with obvious benefits. Back then it was common to hear "serious" photographers pooh-poohing digital, and how it's many drawbacks would mean it would remain niche, and never replace film. It didn't take long and digial cameras improv…

> "I live in an apartment, I can't charge one, on the street" I agree with pretty much everything you said, but I still can't fathom how electric cars are going to make more than a dent in NYC where most cars are stored streetside.

> I still can't fathom how electric cars are going to make more than a dent in NYC where most cars are stored streetside

Consumer/taxpayer demand for a solution, like most problems in a capitalist democracy.

I imagine streets where every nth parking spot has something that looks like a beefy parking meter, but will allow thick-ish extension cords to run from a car to it. Turn it on with an RFID tied to which house you belong to on the street (ensures only locals can use it, charges the electrical costs to the right house).

It's technically doable with the technology in our hands today and not very complicated to install. Give in 10 more years, there'll be even smarter ideas.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#85

Post by kasey_junk »

bryanlarsen wrote: post #70
bhk wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you should park in your building's parking garage, not in the street Let them eat cake, in other words?

They're currently eating free cake. Those parking spots cost the city a lot of money directly and indirectly (some estimates say $100 a month).

But I can’t pay $100 a month for an electrified spot so...

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#86

Post by octorian »

ad_hominem wrote: post #51
saudioger wrote: post #5

The only thing holding back EVs are/were batteries/charging times. Aside from that they're easier to maintain and perform better — on paper they're loads more practical.

That's not the only thing. How about having to drop ~$8K every 6 years to buy all new batteries after the originals have severely degraded. I think battery tech has to improve quite a bit before EVs can truly overcome ICE vehicles in the mainstream.

I wonder how much of this is myth, rather than reality. Or rather, only an issue on cars with poor battery cooling/management.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#87

Post by newnewpdro »

Eric_WVGG wrote: post #74
zizee wrote: post #45

I think that electric car adoption is going to have similar characteristics to digital cameras. I remember playing with an early digital camera and seeing a poor replacement for film, but with obvious benefits. Back then it was common to hear "serious" photographers pooh-poohing digital, and how it's many drawbacks would mean it would remain niche, and never replace film. It didn't take long and digial cameras improv…

> "I live in an apartment, I can't charge one, on the street" I agree with pretty much everything you said, but I still can't fathom how electric cars are going to make more than a dent in NYC where most cars are stored streetside.

Presumably at that point the 0%-100% recharge time will be competitive with pumping gas.

But I do think between now and then we need more infrastructure for tenants to charge at home.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#88

Post by kasey_junk »

newfocogi wrote: post #29
kasey_junk wrote: post #23

My big issue is that in the places that electric cars make the most sense (cities) it’s hardest to own them. What am I going to do, run a really long extension cord from my condo to the random parking spot I found around the block?

This situation is when employers providing chargers in company parking will become a notable work benefit.

I commute via public transit, my employer doesn’t offer parking.

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#89

Post by kasey_junk »

tomjakubowski wrote: post #27
kasey_junk wrote: post #23

My big issue is that in the places that electric cars make the most sense (cities) it’s hardest to own them. What am I going to do, run a really long extension cord from my condo to the random parking spot I found around the block?

Doesn't seem all that hard to solve. My city, Los Angeles, reserves some street parking spots for electric vehicles and has installed outlets on the curb for those spaces. Also, if you live in a city, unless you "reverse commute" to the suburbs, you probably won't drive enough miles regularly that you'd need to charge every night anyway. Give it a fast charge every few days in a commercial garage while you run errand…

Who pays for the power? What % of spots are electrified? If we hit an inflection point how fast can they change that % and how does the answer to the question about payment change?

Re: Electric Vehicles’ Day Will Come, and It Might Come Suddenly

#90

Post by yegle »

zizee wrote: post #45

I think that electric car adoption is going to have similar characteristics to digital cameras. I remember playing with an early digital camera and seeing a poor replacement for film, but with obvious benefits. Back then it was common to hear "serious" photographers pooh-poohing digital, and how it's many drawbacks would mean it would remain niche, and never replace film. It didn't take long and digial cameras improv…

Did government pass laws to force migrating to digital camera back then?
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