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Lesson: cease interning people and they won’t complain about being interned?
Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
351–360 of 728 posts
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#352Worked across very liberal and very conservative places in tech. Neither is pleasant. In my opinion, the American self-image and self-worth largely characterized by subscription to a political ideology is the problem. What bothers me is not dress codes,free meals,open offices,etc... But the very idea that a company would display or promote politics in the work place. Why are companies promoting "pride",donating to tr…
Your mistake is in thinking that you can separate out politics from "work" or any other concept. What you fail to realize is that everything is political. Everything. Politics isn't some concrete, easily identifiable thing you can point at. You can't separate out things into a "Politics" bucket and a "Not Politics" bucket. No, politics pervades every single human interaction. Politics is in everything and everything…
Why are stupid things like politics being proclaimed as the universal influencer behind behavioral decisions? If this is a side effect of putting fairness on a pedestal, then I don't think optimizing for fairness is the right way for society to develop.
Whatever happened to a society that has its roots in "love your neighbor and pray for those who persecute you"? Irrespective of religious beliefs, this is exactly what politically minded people want, but they go about it by hating other people and treating people as non-people - it's a huge hypocrisy and disgraceful behavior.
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#353Worked across very liberal and very conservative places in tech. Neither is pleasant. In my opinion, the American self-image and self-worth largely characterized by subscription to a political ideology is the problem. What bothers me is not dress codes,free meals,open offices,etc... But the very idea that a company would display or promote politics in the work place. Why are companies promoting "pride",donating to tr…
Absolutely. I completely disagree with the whole "bring your whole self to work". No! Bring your professional self to work. The counter-argument is that the causes relate to discrimination in the workforce. I.e., BLM needs to be supported because blacks are underrepresented in the American tech workforce. I disagree these need to be equivalent. It's possible for a company to promote hiring underrepresented minorities…
I think this only makes sense if you see corporations as entities completely separate from the people who work for them.
The way I see it, corporations are the people who work for them and their relationships. And since politics deals with peoples and their relationships, politics in an inherent aspect of corporations. And all attempts to separate the two by promoting politics that differ from the politics of the people in the organization is an act of propaganda.
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#354Earlier quoted context omitted.
You don't get. That isn't why you should respect them!! Their beliefs are not grounds to or not to respect them. Their beliefs are part of their private life. You are able to change what rights and liberties are allowed to you because you can participate in society and politics without getting fired from your jon and exiled for your unpopular beliefs.
If you think a bigot stops being a bigot during a meeting, I honestly don’t know what to tell you.
Just because you find it difficult doesn't mean everyone does. Oh, I know you don't consider that bigotry... But I'm sure someone will.
EDIT: It should probably be pointed out that the definition of bigotry is "intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself.", pulled straight from Google. "If my coworker doesn’t believe ... then I don’t respect them as a coworker or a human being" (pulled from the great-grandparent post, from the same author as the parent) fits that perfectly, no matter what the opinion in the middle is.
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#355Earlier quoted context omitted.
Feminists are still trying to change society and still have a narrative of being about "equal rights" as a concept. They have equality under the law by any reasonable definition. Reproductive health access and family leave laws are the best example I can think of, and even that's a stretch. Do you have better examples?
My impression of the situation is that while the law might confer equal rights, it doesn't result in equal lived experience. Changing the law is one thing; changing culture and expectations is another.
Of course. Changing the law can grant or deny rights, changing culture and expectations can't.
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#356The comments in this thread are shocking, Inquisition level stuff. I can't believe I spend time here. Remember when HN was tech stuff? Now it's: manfredo 16 minutes ago The following views were listed on the memo: * Support of President Trump (e.g. This and Palmer Lucky's campaign contributions) * "All lives matter" * Criticism of Islam's human rights record. * Calling the company's art politically radical . Which, i…
I can see a possibility where manfredo's perspective is genuinely naive of context surrounding of his first three bullet points, and may not be acting in bad faith - and I can see a possibility where brainkim's real feelings aren't as hard-line as the shortened, perhaps understandably heated version. To call these comments "inquisition level", and potentially ignorant of the catastrophic history of suppressing dissen…
Regarding support of Trump, Facebook indeed had an overt internal tone of enmity toward Trump, to the point that admitting to having voted for Trump would have been a frightening prospect in most circles. (I can't speak to the specifics of Palmer Luckey's foibles, only to the general tone regarding Trump.)
Regarding "All Lives Matter", there was indeed inquisition-level blowback. I vacillated between abhorrence, anguish, and rage as I watched the drama unfold.
For context: I was a Facebook employee at the time, and although I tend toward liberal ideals (despite a very conservative upbringing), I was appalled at the level of intolerance toward conservative views. Though I could not in good conscience vote for Trump (nor even throw away my vote on a third-party candidate), I continue to respect other humans who voted for Trump. That felt like a dangerous view to espouse as a Facebook employee, and I saw other employees behave with unease regarding their personal political views. Intolerance is dangerous all around, and in my opinion Facebook's internal politics have fallen (mostly unwittingly) into the trap of "not tolerating intolerance", using a liberal (pun intended) -- IMO overly broad -- definition of intolerance.
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#357Not all views deserve respect. Depending on what specific views they are talking about a lot of the ones circulating should not be tolerated.
There is a difference between "respect" and "tolerance". You don't have to 'respect' anyone's speech, but if we live in a country with Freedom of Speech, then you for sure have to tolerate things you don't agree with. Even if your company decides to ban certain speech, you can't avoid it forever...
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#358Earlier quoted context omitted.
No,they are your coworker. Period. They're not your friend. They are not promoting neo-nazi beliefs at work or direspecting other coworkers,what business of yours is their neo-nazi activity? Peace has a price.
You can't have peace with people who want to kill and oppress a significant portion of the population.
Not with that attitude you can't.
Racists aren't (usually) racists for the fun of it. Racists are racists because they feel threatened by or lack sufficient exposure to / understanding of other races. If your goal is to cure racism, then making racists feel even more threatened is probably the least productive way of going about it.
Instead, the trick is to befriend them. Show them that there's nothing to fear. These people are more often than not just scared and confused; they're usually otherwise-decent people, and putting them at ease goes a long way toward letting them realize on their own that "hey, maybe my Jewish neighbors ain't so bad after all".
I know full well that the above is a lot easier said than done, but if you want a growling dog to stop growling at you, giving it treats is at least slightly more effective than yelling at it. On the former path, you might eventually tame the dog and get a friend out of the deal. On the latter path, it'll just growl louder and louder until it bites you.
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#359Earlier quoted context omitted.
> misogynistic divorce laws, violence against “immodest” women, and application of the death penalty for homosexuality or apostasy It is a caricature. You have been reading the internet too much and spent too little time talking to actual Muslim people. However, if you find out that one of your employees is a member of the taliban, feel free to fire him.
There are 13 Muslim-majority countries where apostasy is punishable by death, including Malaysia, Iran, Nigeria, the UAE, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia. Pakistan only imposes the death sentence for blasphemy. The UK has many sharia courts which act as marriage and divorce authorities, where women often have far fewer rights than men. (This sounds hysterical and far-right-ish, but it’s true) I’ve heard horror stories of ex-…
1/4 of your fellow humans are Muslim, 1.8 billion people. You are going to need at least a few hundred million more examples.
Re: Some Facebook Employees Unite to Challenge Its ‘Intolerant’ Liberal Culture
#360Earlier quoted context omitted.
A small sample of students taking a survey isn't very convincing evidence.
And yet you can't provide any counter evidence.
The burden of proof for efficacy is on the ones dragging employees into mandatory meetings about non-work-related material.
But just for fun, here's another HBR article that shows that "the three most popular interventions make firms less diverse."