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Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

nytimes.com

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Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#231

Post by isostatic »

bopbop wrote: post #151
isostatic wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bezos. Amazon has revolutionised the way we buy things, meaning land is no longer needed for strip malls, oil isn't burnt driving to them, people aren't having inferior things pushed on them by dodgy salesmen, or wasting an hour to buy a single item, or buying the wrong item because the right one is out of stock.

I think there's still quite a significant difference between "popularizing something that may save the planet from extinction from global warming which could have been pursued for quite a while by other large companies automotive and otherwise but hasn't been" to "people prefer shopping with them over how they used to shop". But I can see that the net gain of the time saved using Amazon could be argued as a good for…

Has Telsa really popularised it? Or is this looking at things from an SV perspective?

Certainly in the UK it's a minor player compared with the Nissan Leaf, and plugin hybrids are even more popular

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#232

Post by varjag »

nostrebored wrote: post #205
tomp wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> by making a desirable electric car, the technology they have within the car is nothing exclusive to Tesla. Other companies can build electric cars, but Tesla made the first truly desirable electric car. This is exactly my point. Tesla didn't happen because of Musk's intelligence, or talent, or ingenuity, or genius. It happened because of Musk's drive . Before Tesla/Musk, electric cars weren't even part of the publi…

They absolutely were. The push for non-gas cars existed before Tesla. Tesla made the commitment to make them cheap (which they've arguably failed to do, especially considering that you're being taxed to fund them, regardless of if you're a consumer). Musk is a world-class rent seeker.

Sorry, electric cars before Tesla were Trabant-like lunchboxes on wheels from 3rd tier/garage makers. They were looked upon as eccentricities like velomobiles or hot air balloons. Nissan Leaf of BMW i3 would not been happening if not a mainstream EV market single-handedly formed by Tesla.

You can argue that someone else could have stepped in, but that someone had to be an outsider, not an established car manufacturer. That is something like Tesla and Musk, but with another name.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#233

Post by _bxg1 »

dingaling wrote: post #202
_bxg1 wrote: post #7

This was about what I'd gathered. He's been reckless and made some huge errors in judgement over the past year, but despite it all I hope he succeeds. I don't think he's a hero or a saint like some people do, but his endeavors are having a very real and tangible positive effect on civilization. Most chiefly, as bad as the climate change situation looks right now, it would be so much worse without the insane amount of…

I'd argue that it was mass-production hybrids in the late 90s that moved us towards the renewables-based future. People could buy them without fear of running out of charge, yet they gamified energy-effiency for drivers who had never really considered that beyond the price of petrol at the pump. Without hybrids having shouldered the door open, I doubt that pure EVs would have fared much better than in previous decade…

Before Tesla, electric and especially hybrid cars were (needlessly) seen by society as dorky and lame. In a culture like America's, for a category of cars, that's a death knell condemning them to living in a niche forever. Silly as that barrier was, Tesla managed to change it.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#234

Post by sokoloff »

mattmaroon wrote: post #230
taneq wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What if energy density of batteries doesn't substantially improve and all electric vehicles continue to be unappealing to large chunks of the population due to range anxiety? Why are people still saying this? Is 300 miles then 200+ mph recharge rates not enough for 90%+ of people 100% of the time, and the other 10% of people most of the time?

The problem is most people have one car. 90% of the time isn't enough. And for someone who doesn't live in one of the densest cities, it's nowhere near 90% of the time.

And most people's one car wasn't $50K+ new.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#235

Post by sokoloff »

taneq wrote: post #227
ceejayoz wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Calling someone a pedo because you don't like something they said is, at the very least, an asshole ish thing to do.

The article did suggest that some of his weird behaviour might have been a side effect of using Ambien to sleep.

Sanofi's tweet reference the Rosanne situation seems relevant:

https://twitter.com/sanofius/status/1001824999496404992?lang...

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#236

Post by _bxg1 »

bopbop wrote: post #151
isostatic wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bezos. Amazon has revolutionised the way we buy things, meaning land is no longer needed for strip malls, oil isn't burnt driving to them, people aren't having inferior things pushed on them by dodgy salesmen, or wasting an hour to buy a single item, or buying the wrong item because the right one is out of stock.

I think there's still quite a significant difference between "popularizing something that may save the planet from extinction from global warming which could have been pursued for quite a while by other large companies automotive and otherwise but hasn't been" to "people prefer shopping with them over how they used to shop". But I can see that the net gain of the time saved using Amazon could be argued as a good for…

Add onto that Amazon's systematic, abhorrent treatment of its employees that was required to achieve "more efficient shopping" and the whole thing shows itself as banal, and honestly evil.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#237

Post by Gatsky »

_bxg1 wrote: post #7

This was about what I'd gathered. He's been reckless and made some huge errors in judgement over the past year, but despite it all I hope he succeeds. I don't think he's a hero or a saint like some people do, but his endeavors are having a very real and tangible positive effect on civilization. Most chiefly, as bad as the climate change situation looks right now, it would be so much worse without the insane amount of…

Yeah I agree. Don’t understand why people are so pissed off by Musk, but seem happy to give a free ride to any number of cut and dried vile megarich dynasties like the Koch brothers or the crown prince of Saudi Arabia or whichever asshole owns Elsevier. Consider that these villains are quite literally destroying the planet, impeding scientific progress and manipulating societies for their personal profit.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#238

Post by rjdagost »

askaboutit wrote: post #159
tomhoward wrote: post #37

But, he added, “if you have anyone who can do a better job, please let me know. They can have the job. Is there someone who can do the job better? They can have the reins right now.” I think this hits at the crux of the issue around the performance/behaviour of Musk and other leaders of hugely ambitious companies. And I think it highlights the importance of thinking about what kinds of people it will take to lead the…

Tinfoil hat on. Big industry hates Elon. Rockets are his now. And soon cars will be Tesla’s or at least Electric. Maybe they’ve been bashing him in order to break him. Don’t break the company. Break its leader. Just need to take a look at how tides have turned so quickly against Elon in the last year. Seems very odd. And the short sellers could quite easily be hedge funds backed with big money interests.

It is not odd that the tides have turned against Musk. What is odd is that it took this long for the tides to turn against him. That a company is still around after incinerating cash so rapidly and consistently for ~16 years is an incredible feat. There is big money betting against him, but there is also big money betting for him.

Most of Musk's troubles are of his own doing. He took enormous risks in rushing the Model 3 to production and frankly they have been disastrous. His SEC troubles (which are just starting) are entirely of his own doing.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#239

Post by afarrell »

dingaling wrote: post #188
tomhoward wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with that: it's been my own experience of enduring severe burnout and coming out the other side in much better shape. That's what underpins my point of view on this: if we were better at supporting talented-but-flawed people through personal transformation instead treating them with hatred and ridicule every time they misstep, we could have more great leaders and more great companies.

However the talented-but-flawed people need to recognise that they are flawed, and be open to change.

They also need to express that they are flawed and that they recognise that they are flawed, but in a way that doesn't get twitter piling on them for how much of a wimp they are or how nobody cares about their fee-fees.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#240

Post by elicash »

propter_hoc wrote: post #8

The article notes allegations that the Board is concerned that Mr. Musk has been taking Ambien as a sleeping aid, but instead of sleeping, has been posting bizarre tirades on Twitter. I actually have a number of American* friends who take Ambien frequently with the intent that it be a sleeping aid. However, they all commonly do exactly what Mr. Musk may be doing: failing to sleep after taking their Ambien, and instea…

The little sleep he IS getting isn't even quality. From the author of Why We Sleep:

> Unfortunately, the current set or classes of sleeping pills that we have do not produce naturalistic sleep. So they are all a broad set of chemicals that we call the sedative hypnotics. And sedation is not sleep. It's very different. It doesn't give you the restorative natural benefits of sleep.

https://www.npr.org/2018/07/20/630792401/sleep-scientist-war...

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