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Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

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181–190 of 377 posts

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#181

But, he added, “if you have anyone who can do a better job, please let me know. They can have the job. Is there someone who can do the job better? They can have the reins right now.” I think this hits at the crux of the issue around the performance/behaviour of Musk and other leaders of hugely ambitious companies. And I think it highlights the importance of thinking about what kinds of people it will take to lead the…

> Do we actually want Tesla and SpaceX to fail? Defenitely! I do not think it is good for the world to have even more concentration of economic power in the hands of the US. I hope EVs succeed, and that private space companies start venturing to space in earnest. I just hope that other economic blocks are able to rip the rewards - ideally developing countries, including China and Russia. We already have a terrible si…

The kleptocratic oligarchy and the defacto Xi Dynasty of the empire are the ones you would choose instead? The US has its flaws and sins, serious and worryingly worsening ones but those two are not better hands without some serious reforms.

Not to mention it is seriously flawed thinking on several levels - what is preventing the world from competing with those companies? It isn't the presence in the US proving viability and their failure would not encourage development in "better" places, the opposite in fact. If they want it they'll have to compete. Not everybody can do so right now but breaking other people's legs doesn't make you run faster.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#182
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The presence of an SEC investigation is cause for concern. But why not just say that? Why repeat absurd rumors about billion dollar investor lawsuits? What does it gain you to spread, by your own admission, completely baseless rumors? I keep thinking HN is not the place for this sort of nonsense but then maybe I'm the one in the wrong. Certainly most discussions about Musk here are not based on any kind of rational a…

>>Why repeat absurd rumors about billion dollar investor lawsuits? You misunderstand. The calculation is not about a single lawsuit costing billions. It's about potential damages from ALL possible lawsuits from pissed off short-sellers. And that's not absurd at all - it's a real possibility, since Tesla stock is one of the most popular on the stock market.

>It's about potential damages from ALL possible lawsuits from pissed off short-sellers.

What happens if you bought calls for a price higher than $420? They are worthless. You don't have to be a short-seller to have been burned by this.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#183

But, he added, “if you have anyone who can do a better job, please let me know. They can have the job. Is there someone who can do the job better? They can have the reins right now.” I think this hits at the crux of the issue around the performance/behaviour of Musk and other leaders of hugely ambitious companies. And I think it highlights the importance of thinking about what kinds of people it will take to lead the…

Tinfoil hat on. Big industry hates Elon. Rockets are his now. And soon cars will be Tesla’s or at least Electric. Maybe they’ve been bashing him in order to break him. Don’t break the company. Break its leader. Just need to take a look at how tides have turned so quickly against Elon in the last year. Seems very odd. And the short sellers could quite easily be hedge funds backed with big money interests.

If your company is failing to meet goals and you know it, your PR department can keep the wolves at bay for some time. If you can't fix the problems, eventually the real situation of your company will start to come to light, and opinions will change abruptly, since the contrast between the PR and reality will have grown huge.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#184
post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've long resigned to the fact that there will always be ambitious assholes in the world. The best we can hope for is to corral the assholes in the right space. An asshole leading a tech/space company is far better than an asshole leading an oil company or running a country.

Weird how you can judge someone's character based on a few tweets.

Calling someone a pedo because you don't like something they said is, at the very least, an assholeish thing to do.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#185

But, he added, “if you have anyone who can do a better job, please let me know. They can have the job. Is there someone who can do the job better? They can have the reins right now.” I think this hits at the crux of the issue around the performance/behaviour of Musk and other leaders of hugely ambitious companies. And I think it highlights the importance of thinking about what kinds of people it will take to lead the…

I'm not American and the arrogance and cognitive dissonance rubs me the wrong way. You are the CEO of a company not a visionary prophet. People like Musk wouldn't last a week here.

>People like Musk wouldn't last a week here.

Don't worry, this is just Tesla PR working overtime trying to mop up the latest folly. HackerNews is lapping it up, of course. Not everyone feels sorry for Elon Musk. He can quit at any time.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#186
Really Elon Musk has struck me as honestly in need of psychiatric help - not in a derogatory way but a sincere one. Between the outbursts, shortsighted impulsive decisions, and well being CEO of so many different companies at once it sort of resembles some combination of ADHD and Bipolar.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#187
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gwynne Shotwell seems to be doing that just fine. Surely she's not unique in the world - though I do agree that COOs that meet Elon's bar are probably extremely rare.

From what I've read she is not afraid to confront him on different issues. She is as passionate about SpaceX as he is.

Yeah - she was also a first-year employee, SpaceX's eleventh overall. She's got the seniority and the clear long-term established loyalty to be able to say "no", something a newly-minted Tesla COO wouldn't necessarily have.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're right. But I know many people who went through burnouts and came out better - kept everything that made them great but lost a little of the obsessive edge. Musk at 95% intensity would still be a fabulous captain of industry. Maybe he'll actually change for the better because of all this.

I agree with that: it's been my own experience of enduring severe burnout and coming out the other side in much better shape. That's what underpins my point of view on this: if we were better at supporting talented-but-flawed people through personal transformation instead treating them with hatred and ridicule every time they misstep, we could have more great leaders and more great companies.

However the talented-but-flawed people need to recognise that they are flawed, and be open to change.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're right. But I know many people who went through burnouts and came out better - kept everything that made them great but lost a little of the obsessive edge. Musk at 95% intensity would still be a fabulous captain of industry. Maybe he'll actually change for the better because of all this.

I agree with that: it's been my own experience of enduring severe burnout and coming out the other side in much better shape. That's what underpins my point of view on this: if we were better at supporting talented-but-flawed people through personal transformation instead treating them with hatred and ridicule every time they misstep, we could have more great leaders and more great companies.

First off, I am not certain it is such a bleak personal experience to work for these companies, an engineer friend at Space X HQ is usually pulling around 40-50h work weeks, which seems sustainable if a little intense.

Some industries operate under almost continuous crunches, the video games sector is notorious for this, and it might be that this is the case here too, and that my friend is just lucky to be on a team that is spared being overworked. It doesn't matter that people work on something they're passionate about, at a certain point it gets too much for anyone. I also got close to a burnout, and I did learn important lessons about managing my work life balance, working passionately while avoiding toxic stress, etc [wrote too much personal stuff, pasted under].

To get back to the point though, I wonder whether I would be able to remember these lessons and manage my work-life balance correctly, if I thought my work was as world changing as what Tesla and Space X are doing. I am deeply grateful that people like Elon Musk and the many others in these companies are willing to make decisions that might deprive them of time with their loved ones, potentially affect their health too, to bring such a change about.

I mean, the overarching goal of Space X to make life multi-planetary might seem like PR fluff to some, but I agree that we will extinguish ourselves if we stay on one planet. I would prefer that governments pool resources and achieve this public good through public means, as I find dangerous that a private company might end up having a monopoly on affordable space access. However, our governments fail on this and can't even agree on curbing climate change effectively, though it is a much more obvious danger, so I can only support Space X in their endeavor, and wholeheartedly wish them success.

-- [the personal stuff] I once worked 6 months without a single day off (work weeks of about 90 hours), which to some may appear like a manageable amount of stress, but I was in my early 20s and didn't know how to do this properly. We did make our deadline and things that needed to happen in that time frame did, but after it, lo and behold, the cough I'd had for a month for no apparent reason suddenly stopped. Good that it did too, as my throat was so irritated I was coughing a bit of blood in the end. Sorry for the gory detail there, but just to point out that being overworked does have some very real and physical repercussions, besides also leading to painful life choices. Not realizing my grandfather was in his final days when he was admitted to the hospital with a bad cough, and not getting there in time to say goodbye, is my personal low point in this regard, and something I have regretted ever since. I wish I hadn't needed to make such a terrible error in judgement to learn this lesson, but I did not make this mistake again, and prioritizing family and friends over work, however important whatever task or deadline might seem in the instant, is something I very much kept it mind since. It has made me much happier, and hasn't negatively impacted my work output in any way I can measure.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#190
post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love how, from a technical perspective, Elon Musk is a startup founder's worst dream. You start up a company, some VC literally pushes the co-founders out of the company and takes over the reins. Is this really the person HN should be rooting for?

The VC chose the best CEO (which happened to be himself) for the company, in the best interest of the company, its employees and its shareholders. History absolves him. The real question is, were they adequately compensated for their contributions (I've no idea myself).

> The VC chose the best CEO (which happened to be himself) for the company, in the best interest of the company, its employees and its shareholders.

In the same way Dick Cheney chose the best VP (which happened to be himself).

> History absolves him.

History absolves nothing. We've got no idea whatsoever how Tesla would have fared without a self-aggrandising marketer at the helm.

Chances are it might have killed fewer people.

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