Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year • Hacker News Board

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#151

Post by bopbop » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:16 AM UTC

isostatic wrote: post #102

_bxg1 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Name another billionaire, other than maybe Bill Gates, who's presently doing anything good, at all.

Bezos. Amazon has revolutionised the way we buy things, meaning land is no longer needed for strip malls, oil isn't burnt driving to them, people aren't having inferior things pushed on them by dodgy salesmen, or wasting an hour to buy a single item, or buying the wrong item because the right one is out of stock.

I think there's still quite a significant difference between "popularizing something that may save the planet from extinction from global warming which could have been pursued for quite a while by other large companies automotive and otherwise but hasn't been" to "people prefer shopping with them over how they used to shop". But I can see that the net gain of the time saved using Amazon could be argued as a good for society.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#152

Post by whyever » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:22 AM UTC

hobofan wrote: post #86

_bxg1 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The self-driving crashes have mostly been users using autopilot irresponsibly, from what I've read. Still, I'm not arguing the finer points; both Musk the person and Tesla the company have made some bad, sometimes even ethically dubious decisions. My point was that, for all of today's Captains Of Industry "solving problems" that's don't actually exist, dismantling democracy and privacy and destroying millions of peop…

> The self-driving crashes have mostly been users using autopilot irresponsibly Tesla has been advertising the autopilot capabilities irresponsibly. With advertising like that on their website[0] they should be held accountable (at least partially at fault) for crashes resulting from autopilot failure. [0]: https://www.tesla.com/autopilot

> All Tesla vehicles produced in our factory, including Model 3, have the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver.

Wow, this is a ludicrous claim without providing any evidence.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#153

Post by tomhoward » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:24 AM UTC

skgoa wrote: post #137

tomhoward wrote: post #37

But, he added, “if you have anyone who can do a better job, please let me know. They can have the job. Is there someone who can do the job better? They can have the reins right now.” I think this hits at the crux of the issue around the performance/behaviour of Musk and other leaders of hugely ambitious companies. And I think it highlights the importance of thinking about what kinds of people it will take to lead the…

> But when I see the hate and vitriol heaped on him, I'm compelled to wonder just what kind of alternative universe people are wishing for. One where CEOs don't lie, don't insult heroes, don't cyberstalk journalists etc. Musk has only himself to blame for the pushback he is getting for being such a collossal douche.

I completely agree that all that behaviour is appalling, but my point is: do you want him to change or do you want him and his companies to not exist?

Because the alternative to him and his companies not existing is not simply that we get all the positive aspects of those companies but just provided by someone nicer.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#154

Post by ritchiea » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:26 AM UTC

irishbro wrote: post #150

propter_hoc wrote: post #8

The article notes allegations that the Board is concerned that Mr. Musk has been taking Ambien as a sleeping aid, but instead of sleeping, has been posting bizarre tirades on Twitter. I actually have a number of American* friends who take Ambien frequently with the intent that it be a sleeping aid. However, they all commonly do exactly what Mr. Musk may be doing: failing to sleep after taking their Ambien, and instea…

Didn't Roseanne also blame her tweet controversy on taking Ambien aswel?

Yes but Ambien doesn't have a side effect of gifting the taker racist views.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#155

Post by travbrack » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:26 AM UTC

skrebbel wrote: post #92

tomhoward wrote: post #37

But, he added, “if you have anyone who can do a better job, please let me know. They can have the job. Is there someone who can do the job better? They can have the reins right now.” I think this hits at the crux of the issue around the performance/behaviour of Musk and other leaders of hugely ambitious companies. And I think it highlights the importance of thinking about what kinds of people it will take to lead the…

There's a hidden false dichotomy there: That Tesla and Space X couldn't exist / succeed without Musk working his employees and himself into a burnout. I'm not sure that that is true. The same Musk with the same employees could've perfectly well done these companies at a sane pace - maybe even without losing speed in the grand scheme of things given that less stuff would've gone wrong.

They're struggling to meet production goals even with the staff burning the candle at both ends, and using a highly automated assembly line. What could they do to be more efficient? I'm sure Musk would love to hear if you have an idea.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#156

Post by pas » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:33 AM UTC

cepth wrote: post #112

Animats wrote: post #11

"Then he got in a Tesla Model S and drove himself to the airport. En route, Mr. Musk typed his fateful message." Don't text while driving. This going private thing is a strange idea. Sell Tesla to the Saudi sovereign wealth fund? The one dedicated to keeping oil a viable industry? Does he want Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud as a boss? That makes no sense. Softbank might make sense. Part of Musk's problem seems to be "O…

Saudi Arabia has the whole Vision 2030 plan in motion. The general thrust is they want to diversify the country away from being a petrostate. The headline numbers for state investment in renewables are nothing to scoff at: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-01-16/saudi-ara... I can’t find the link right now, but Bloomberg did a short ~30 minute documentary 4-5 years ago on Saudi efforts to build a biofuel r…

> Aramco IPO going nowhere fast

Why? Could you elaborate on this please?

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#157

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:37 AM UTC

tomhoward wrote: post #37

But, he added, “if you have anyone who can do a better job, please let me know. They can have the job. Is there someone who can do the job better? They can have the reins right now.” I think this hits at the crux of the issue around the performance/behaviour of Musk and other leaders of hugely ambitious companies. And I think it highlights the importance of thinking about what kinds of people it will take to lead the…

[deleted]

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#158

Post by khamoud » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:38 AM UTC

oblio wrote: post #132

Fifer82 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that is just because you are a shit within that piece group rather than an exception.

I didn't even say they were a group, just individuals :) And can't you just accept that some people are good?

I don’t think so. I think it’s pretty naive to think some people exist without personality flaws.

Everything people do is out of some sort of greed. Some of it results in good deeds others not so much.

You volunteer or donate to charity because it makes you feel good, boosts your ego, and/or inflates your sense of self worth but you ARE being helpful in the grand scheme of things.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#159

Post by askaboutit » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:40 AM UTC

tomhoward wrote: post #37

But, he added, “if you have anyone who can do a better job, please let me know. They can have the job. Is there someone who can do the job better? They can have the reins right now.” I think this hits at the crux of the issue around the performance/behaviour of Musk and other leaders of hugely ambitious companies. And I think it highlights the importance of thinking about what kinds of people it will take to lead the…

Tinfoil hat on. Big industry hates Elon. Rockets are his now. And soon cars will be Tesla’s or at least Electric. Maybe they’ve been bashing him in order to break him. Don’t break the company. Break its leader.

Just need to take a look at how tides have turned so quickly against Elon in the last year. Seems very odd. And the short sellers could quite easily be hedge funds backed with big money interests.

Re: Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year

#160

Post by Fnoord » Fri, Aug 17, 2018, 10:42 AM UTC

l33tbro wrote: post #140

Fnoord wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its easy to say that because the chance of it happening is slim, and it allows for him to bail out if that's occurring short-term. For me, Musk's major failure was with the children who were lost in a cave and his pedophile tweet. Everyone has flaws and makes mistakes, but that mistake showed me how flawed his personality is. It was classic narcissism behaviour, right from textbook.

>classic narcissism behaviour ... I've run out of fingers to count how many times over the last few months I've see keyboard psychiatrists apply 'narcissism' as a catch-all for any kind of outlier behaviours. I'm no Musk fanboy, but the narcissism trope feels particularly way off in his case.

Mind you, I didn't call him a narcissist. I said its classic narcissism behaviour. There's a subtle nuance between those two. There's no further psychoanalysis either.

I want to be a Musk fanboy. I am very much into the things he's innovating. I care about those things (solar power, electric vehicles, (self-)sustainability in general, though SpaceX not so much). He's become a if not the face of those ideals I find important. That's why that particular tweet was so disgusting and ultimately disappointing to me. I did not see it coming!