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Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

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11–20 of 167 posts

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#11
post #9

I think it's fine. If you did nothing wrong then you have nothing to lose by unlocking your phone. So if you don't unlock your phone, it's an admission of guilt. People are way too paranoid. Nobody cares about what you do with your phone. Sometimes I feel like the upper classes of society (especially hypocrites who have money and a reputation to protect) are projecting their fears on all other classes. Then like fool…

Was this meant as a joke?

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#12
post #7
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or snap it in half, most phones will do this easily.

Would you, under immediate threat, be able to locate and destroy the memory chips—and specifically the memory chips—on your phone? If they're prepared to lock you up for 10 years, they're prepared to do some serious digital forensics on some unsnapped chips.

Hence, the hammer.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#13
post #4
post #3

Seems like the only logical solution is to carry a hammer to destroy your phone if necessary. If the heat hasn't told you they want your phone, there's nothing legally stopping you from destroying your own property if you see them coming...

Or snap it in half, most phones will do this easily.

We found JerryRigEverything's HN!

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#14
post #8

Genuinely curious - What is the current state / precedent for this type of situation in the US?

US: Life sentence. If a judge orders you to unlock your laptop/phone and you don't -- it could be a life sentence. IMHO, they go around the constitution with "Contempt of court".

https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/03/man-jailed-indef...

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#15
post #8

Genuinely curious - What is the current state / precedent for this type of situation in the US?

Complicated. 5th amendment protections against self-incrimination prevents the court from using the fact that you can unlock your phone with a password you know from being used against you. Court opinion has been mixed as to whether you can have an obligation to reveal a password. Even then, the government requires a warrant to search the phone, and that requires a reasonable belief that they would find evidence on it. They can't just go fishing and make you help them.

There's less protection for fingerprint based unlock mechanisms and the like. It's not "something you know", so they're free to compel you to provide it.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#16
post #9

I think it's fine. If you did nothing wrong then you have nothing to lose by unlocking your phone. So if you don't unlock your phone, it's an admission of guilt. People are way too paranoid. Nobody cares about what you do with your phone. Sometimes I feel like the upper classes of society (especially hypocrites who have money and a reputation to protect) are projecting their fears on all other classes. Then like fool…

If the world needs to be more transparent, then I think it should start with the Australian politicians. Give us access to their phones and computers, give us CCTV in their offices. Then we can be sure that no crimes are being committed, that no corruption takes place. They are, after all, working for us.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#17
post #8

Genuinely curious - What is the current state / precedent for this type of situation in the US?

US: Life sentence. If a judge orders you to unlock your laptop/phone and you don't -- it could be a life sentence. IMHO, they go around the constitution with "Contempt of court". https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/03/man-jailed-indef...

Unless you're a politician, then you can just "have no recollection."

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#18
post #7
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or snap it in half, most phones will do this easily.

Would you, under immediate threat, be able to locate and destroy the memory chips—and specifically the memory chips—on your phone? If they're prepared to lock you up for 10 years, they're prepared to do some serious digital forensics on some unsnapped chips.

Would factory resetting your phone be sufficient, or is data still recoverable even after the standard factory reset option on Android (and I assume, iPhones)? I don't really know much about these "serious forensics."

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#19
post #9

I think it's fine. If you did nothing wrong then you have nothing to lose by unlocking your phone. So if you don't unlock your phone, it's an admission of guilt. People are way too paranoid. Nobody cares about what you do with your phone. Sometimes I feel like the upper classes of society (especially hypocrites who have money and a reputation to protect) are projecting their fears on all other classes. Then like fool…

I upvoted this comment not because I agree with this viewpoint, but specifically because I don't, and I want this to be seen by more people.

Whether this is an attempt at trolling or not, I am not sure, but I believe many people, especially those somewhat removed from marginalized populations, also hold this viewpoint.

I advise those that hold this viewpoint to see the excellent video, "Don't Talk to Cops". This should not be seen as an indictment of the many good people that work in law enforcement, but rather one of a system that incentivizes convictions over actual guilt or innocence.

At any moment in time, it we are breaking so many laws because of how the laws are written. It's illegal to speed. Who has never done that? A cop can pull you over. If the cop is having a bad day, and asks you to do something you don't want to, and you argue, now you're resisting arrest, which is another crime. And then for how many people has the next step been imprisonment and/or death due to an altercation that all started from a thing nearly everyone does almost every day?

The government does not need more powers to find more people guilty of crimes that shouldn't even be illegal. There are already too many people in jail and too many people dead due to a justice system that, sadly, skews far away from actual justice.

Re: Australians who won't unlock their phones could face ten years in jail

#20
post #9

I think it's fine. If you did nothing wrong then you have nothing to lose by unlocking your phone. So if you don't unlock your phone, it's an admission of guilt. People are way too paranoid. Nobody cares about what you do with your phone. Sometimes I feel like the upper classes of society (especially hypocrites who have money and a reputation to protect) are projecting their fears on all other classes. Then like fool…

>People are way too paranoid. Nobody cares about what you do with your phone.

Perhaps others' lives are too uneventful. In these here parts of Western Europe we had 3 dictatorships active within the last 50 years (up to ~1980 -- Spain, Portugal, Greece), including torture and everything. Easter Europe had worse up to 1989. All could come back quite easily.

And even in other parts of Western Europe there was mass surveillance of political opposition, lots of cases against activists, hundreds of thousands of people against the political establishment (e.g. in Italy), mafia, etc.

Not everywhere is like rural Iowa.

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