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Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

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Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#71

Post by epochwolf »

gcheong wrote: post #55
Entlin wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the best post in this entire thread. People don't get bullied in adulthood because there is a working police and judicial entity. People get bullied as kids because there isn't one. Currently kids grow up for 18 years in a everyone-for-himself, in-order-to-be-successfull-you-need-physical-strength-and-iron-will world, and just then they switch to the much better and fairer world where being sucessful is not de…

"People don't get bullied in adulthood because there is a working police and judicial entity." Unfortunately while adults may be largely free from the physical violence, workplace bullying does occur. Usually it is more subtle than the outright taunting and physical violence of schoolyard bullies, which means its harder to retaliate against but it can be very stressful - and HR is not on your side. "Currently kids gr…

> HR is not on your side.

Given the regulations in the United States that's hardly a surprise.

I'm not in HR but have I heard/read things from a few sources. You have to deal with people using HR to harass their victims, lack of evidence and the list just continues. And when it's management above HR doing harasment, they don't have the authority to stop it. It's a rather thankless job.

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#72

Post by gcheong »

lwhi wrote: post #36
Dove wrote: post #14

I disagree strongly with the sentiment that bullies just need love, that they're only doing it because they are hurting too. People are diverse, so I won't deny that perhaps that's sometimes true. But I think it would be more accurate to say that bullies do it because it's fun and above all because they can . In short, bullies need to face punishments with teeth. And the bullied need to have access to a justice syste…

Complex problems don't have simple solutions. Unfortunately a lot of the time, a child who's victimising another child will be projecting emotions that they're feeling, due to abuse / difficulties they're experiencing themselves. To think that the problem can be hugged out is crazy - it's not going to happen. I think the first most useful thing to do is to teach the child to fight back. Often a change of attitude - b…

I think it may be more accurate to say that complex problems don't have "simplistic" solutions as sometimes there can be relatively simple solutions and I would not rule out the possibility for a problem like bullying. For example, depression is a problem with a complex origin but cognitive therapy is a relatively brief and simple solution that has been shown to be effective in many cases. Simplistic solutions, e.g. "think positive", however, do not work.

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#73

Post by hugh3 »

pasbesoin wrote: post #19

If I ever have kids, they get martial arts training. From someone who emphasizes self-awareness and a productive discipline, but who does not skimp on the full range of effective techniques and the physical training to achieve them. They may like it more or less. Regardless, it will be a part of their schooling. Bullying ends when you end it. There may be more than one way to accomplish this, but when you're outnumbe…

Everybody is talking about making sure their kid grows up with fighting skills so he can fight back when he gets bullied.

Why don't y'all just try to teach your children some social skills and general non-weirdness so that they're not the obvious bully magnet?

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#74

Post by [deleted] »

xiongchiamiov wrote: post #33
lionhearted wrote: post #11

This comment will be controversial, especially for North Americans and Western Europeans. I ask you to read it and think about it a moment before reacting, and comment if you disagree. I believe what I'm about to say is true, and I'm not trying to get a rise out of people - I want to fix some problems with society. I feel for the author. I also moved around a lot as a kid. No, wasn't a military family. Just coinciden…

The fucking Batman?

[deleted]

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#75

Post by feral »

itistoday wrote: post #64
bootload wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"... But son, as soon as someone puts their hands on you, they've crossed a line. Fuck them up. It's the only thing these vicious freaks understand. They're wild animals. They make violence on you, you need to show them that you're the stronger, bigger animal. When someone attacks you maliciously for no reason, you need to impose your will on them. ..." And the first girl who uses an indirect asymmetric attack? This…

Just want you to know, I really appreciate your post and for mentioning Aikido. Of all the martial arts I know, I find it to be the most profound and wise in its philosophy. There is also the interesting practice of Tonglen that I was recently introduced to. It is a meditation technique (endorsed and practiced by the Dalai Lama), that teaches you how to train your mind to effectively and healthily handle the issue of…

Profound and wise, and less than optimally effective. Its a little like the bullying problem in microcosm.

In theory, Aikido is wonderful and beautiful and the right way to solve the problem. But, fundamentally, trying to block and redirect someones attacks away from you without doing violence to either party is a much riskier strategy than striking back. Its just much harder to do right.

In practice, if you do end up in a serious fight in which your physical well-being is at risk, you want the most effective strategies, that have the lowest risk of going wrong, and that's not Aikido.

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#76

Post by kentosi »

zeraholladay wrote: post #63
Entlin wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the best post in this entire thread. People don't get bullied in adulthood because there is a working police and judicial entity. People get bullied as kids because there isn't one. Currently kids grow up for 18 years in a everyone-for-himself, in-order-to-be-successfull-you-need-physical-strength-and-iron-will world, and just then they switch to the much better and fairer world where being sucessful is not de…

Not all bullying situations are necessarily toxic or dangerous. Consider hazing and boot camp, both of which are essentially sanctioned bullying. I suspect a good number of people actually enjoy hazing (joining a fraternity) and others believe military training builds character, etc. Likewise, try entertaining the idea that childhood bullying (within reason) might serve a social purpose. I've heard multiple first han…

The difference is that your first paragraph involves consent, and the second paragraph doesn't.

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#77

Post by brc »

VladRussian wrote: post #41
lionhearted wrote: post #11

This comment will be controversial, especially for North Americans and Western Europeans. I ask you to read it and think about it a moment before reacting, and comment if you disagree. I believe what I'm about to say is true, and I'm not trying to get a rise out of people - I want to fix some problems with society. I feel for the author. I also moved around a lot as a kid. No, wasn't a military family. Just coinciden…

>If you're not strong enough to impose your will on someone making violence on you, then train and get stronger. If you're intelligent, it doesn't matter if the other guy is bigger than you. Take up boxing or martial arts. Brain beats brawn. In 9th grade having a little boxing under my belt, i was attacked by and successfully won the fight with 2 10th graders. Well, a half-day latter, the 10+ of them met me. Not ever…

But did the bullying stop? Was that the end of it? I don't think of bullying as a single or even pair of incidents. The type of bullying being discussed here is years of mental and physical torment.

Physical bumps and bruises heal, mental bruises not so quickly. You may have lost the battle but won the war by showing strength to the bullies and to yourself.

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#78

Post by feral »

lionhearted wrote: post #11

This comment will be controversial, especially for North Americans and Western Europeans. I ask you to read it and think about it a moment before reacting, and comment if you disagree. I believe what I'm about to say is true, and I'm not trying to get a rise out of people - I want to fix some problems with society. I feel for the author. I also moved around a lot as a kid. No, wasn't a military family. Just coinciden…

I reckon HN posters, much more than average, could be categorised as 'nerds who learned to fight back'.

No; seriously, I'd bet the thoughts underlying the parent post is a principal distinguishing component of the psychological makeup of the typical HN poster.

I'm going to assume that readers here are likely to have been bullied at school. More than average we were probably the nerds, the geeks; so often in school being smart is sufficient to attract bad attention.

I'd be willing to speculate further and say that the people that endured this process, and yet ended up sufficiently driven and risk-taking to get involved in startups, probably overlap those that eventually came to the conclusion that resistance was part of the answer; and that sometimes fighting back is better than passively accepting your fate.

There's a similarity in the attitudes of 'fk it, I wont let you away with that' and 'fk it, lets build this'.

Me, I was bullied for years and years. I was always the good kid, I tried to do what I thought was the right thing; turn the other cheek, feel sorry for them. It just did not help.

My dad eventually started sending me to karate classes. Time passed. I started fighting back. (Only a token resistance, scrapes and bruises, but that's mainly what is necessary) Things changed. This was a watershed in my development as a person.

There was still psychological bullying; but its considerably easier to deal with that when people aren't beating the crap out of you.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that a common characteristic of the people that read HN is probably a fighting attitude; the understanding that in some situations game theory does make sense, and that a willingness to engage in MAD behaviour has a value. I'm not trying to say this is a necessary condition, or the best answer, but just that sometimes its the least bad one.

I'm an extremely gentle person, and I'll turn the other cheek as long as I can; but I understand the benefit - to everyone involved, I'd argue - of fighting back decisively, in extremis.

If my kids are bullied, I'll teach them both conflict resolution skills, and martial arts.

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#79

Post by brc »

brudgers wrote: post #10

PG's essay along similar lines: http://www.paulgraham.com/nerds.html

That essay, and the one about creating value are the two best in the collection.

Schools really are a solution to the problem of what to do with kids all day. It's barbaric but it's not going anywhere.

Re: Memoirs of a Bullied Kid

#80

Post by feral »

Scared31YearOld wrote: post #65

Dan's open some seriously deep wounds..... Am a 31 year old and this is a throw away account. I have asked many questions here on HN and some, read correctly, clearly showed my level of self-belief. Since the age of 13 I was bullied, very little physical, mainly regarding my appearence and colour. I am Indian, a little darker than my fellow indian school mates. As I grew up, the the name calling and the playground bu…

Always take advice on the internet with a grain of salt - mine included - but I'll say the following:

You sound like you've had a tough time. You are being very hard on yourself in your post.

You say your doctor came to the conclusion you were depressed before he died. Go talk to another doctor about it. You might have to talk to more than one to find someone good; but find someone good that listens to what you say.

Maybe get them to refer you to someone that will do talking sessions with you so you can talk out the issues you wrote about, and start to process them.

Talking this stuff out, with someone who is good at this process, is something that helped several techies I know get where they want.

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