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Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

theguardian.com

191–200 of 478 posts

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#191
post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “Linux Kernel Networking Subsystem” How do they say this in Japanese? In Chinese (Mandarin/Cantonese)?

Something like リニキス カーネル ネットワークイング サブシステム It's basically English pumped though a lossy algo. I hate katakana and hope it dies soon.

I think that the proper term is "Linuxカーネルネットワークサブシステム" meaning "Linux Kernel Network Subsystem".

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But 'common' is derived from Latin, too! :P

Yes true (although it is from Old French) - let's go for 'shared speech' instead :)

And, I'm sure people have heard of it before, there's a semi-conlang that proposes to remove all Romance borrowings from English called Anglish [1]. There's also "Uncleftish Beholding" which tries to explain basic atomic theory using only native words [2].

[1] http://anglish.wikia.com/wiki/Main_leaf

[2]https://groups.google.com/forum/message/raw?msg=alt.language...

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Computers will translate in real time. Binary is the universal language of classic computers based on electromagnetic physics. Assuming quantum computing or some other unforeseen technology doesn’t replace other forms of computing then we will likely all be relying on binary in one way or another.

Google translate does a just about acceptable job on Indo European languages. Diverge a little further and it often descends into comically poor. One of the most enjoyable things I used to find about travel was experiencing and dipping into other cultures and trying out a little local language picked up from phrase books etc. These days people seem to prefer practising their English on me as I'm a native English spea…

> Google translate does a just about acceptable job on Indo European languages. Diverge a little further and it often descends into comically poor.

Not even all Indo-European ones. It's absolutely awful at trying to translate to and from Irish, for instance.

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's mildly interesting how you (and the article) use 'Lingua franca' (Latin) and not it's English meaning of 'common language'. Edit: s/Italian/Latin/

English speakers are not snobs; we borrow nice words and turns of phrase from wherever we encounter them. It's why English spelling is such a mess.

> English speakers are not snobs; we borrow nice words and turns of phrase from wherever we encounter them.

“We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary.” —James Nicoll

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well my source is a Linguistics Textbook (Language Files, 11th Edition, p15-16) but it says that these changes happened as late as the 17th and 18th centuries because Scholars considered written Latin to be the ideal language (likely because most historical works had been translated to Latin at some point). So even though ending sentences in prepositions had been common for centuries in spoken English, that became fr…

>- Don't ending sentences in prepositions >- Don't split infinitives >- Don't use double negative These seem to really be some rules that ain't nobody got time for!

Because they were never really rules at all in English, until those grammarians decided to try to make the language conform to Latin's rules.

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#196
post #113

In many European countries, you cannot get a good job (like one with an international company) unless you can communicate in English at CEFRL B1 proficiency [1]. China may very well become the largest economy in the world, and there is no way that Chinese, as a multi-toned, symbolic language, will ever become the Lingua franca, as it is near impossible for most adults to learn, in contrast to English [2]. It can be a…

Yeah, it feels like gradually transitioning to English as the primary language would be the one of the best ways to improve the economy in most EU countries (as well as non-EU countries to some extent) since it would dramatically boost skilled immigration, and also make their citizens more educated and make communication with foreigner easier.

Boosting immigration isn't necessarily a desired outcome. Also, why would speaking English specifically make anyone more educated? Compared to, say, German or Chinese?

I agree with the benefit of English as the contemporary lingua franca, but these two reasons given don't make sense to me as a driver for "transitioning to English".

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#197
post #57

English is such a horrible language to learn, I pity non-native speakers. On that basis, the rule is: you're not allowed to criticize another person's English, unless it's their native one. They didn't ask for this language, it was forced upon them.

that's true. that's what a lot of natives just miss, linguistic imperialism is real: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linguistic_imperialism

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#198
post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> global English style I am afraid there's no such thing.

There is such a thing called transatlantic pronunciation.

It is a good thing, then, that there is only one ocean, the Atlantic, across which English is spoken.

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then explain to me why the French are using Go, To etc. instead of TB and GB like everyone else?

They actively avoid loan words from English https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Académie_française#Anglicisms

Kind of. TFA mentions this:

> In some countries, such as France and Israel, special linguistic commissions have been working for decades to stem the English tide by creating new coinages of their own – to little avail, for the most part.

Re: Behemoth, bully, thief: how the English language is taking over the planet

#200

The best point that the article touches on is that English is a good "neutral" language for countries like Sudan and entities like the EU with many different languages spoken. There is a bit of a snowball effect where any language having the advantage of being spoken as a cross-cultural communication language further incentivizes learning that language for people wishing to communicate in that manner. I think such a…

I'm a native (British) English speaker, and I actually can find it quite hard to communicate with non-native speakers, because they don't understand my accent. It's not particularly strong as British accents go (nothing like Glaswegian or Geordie for example), but it really caused problems when I moved to a research group which was made up of primarily English-as-a-second-language speakers. The other thing I found wa…

I wonder if "Singlish" is the future. It's a dialect of English spoken in Singapore, but due to the Chinese influence, it is sometimes stripped of all tenses, for example.
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