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The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

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Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#161

Post by SketchySeaBeast »

gowld wrote: post #148
sli wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't say they're ancillary, most of what you said is the claimed benefit of homework (regardless of the correctness of that claim). I'd say you're mostly using the homework as a guide for tutoring, which isn't something that actually requires homework to be assigned by the school if you're willing to be proactive.

Some parents need a little nudge to support their children's education beyond "school is daycare while I work".

I wonder how many actually bridge that gap - if education is just something to keep a kid occupied, homework will be same, I'm sure.

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#162

Post by gowld »

afarrell wrote: post #67
privacypoller wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure what jurisdiction you're in, but I'm in Canada where we generally have good teachers. The problem we're experiencing is a curriculum that we feel is becoming easier over time and shifting away from core fundamentals. Teachers are powerless to oppose or address this, regardless of how they personally feel or want to teach. Should my 10-yr-old learn coping strategies for anxiety? absolutely, but she should als…

I notice that The things you list are things that can learn online from youtube and video games. - Geography Now: https://youtu.be/DxxZOsfsIUM - Crash Course Computer Science: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL8dPuuaLjXtNlUrzyH5r6... - 6.004 EdX: https://www.edx.org/course/computation-structures-part-1-dig... - Hearts of Iron, Europa Universalis, Sid Meyer’s Pirates, Railroad Tycoon, bunches of kids games teach…

Not sure why this is downvoted. Learning facts is the easiest thing to do in any settings. Learning skills like "how to read and manage workloads, and advice on what to rea" is what needs guidance and training.

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#163

Post by gowld »

loco5niner wrote: post #80
burfog wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a slightly different way to interpret that. Some students, despite being in your classroom, are really being homeschooled. For example, my wife and I both got extra assignments from our parents. The parents aren't just helping. The parents are teaching. You aren't trusted to teach. Other students have parents that trust you to teach. Your job is to teach, and these parents expect you to do it. In theory, the…

I wouldn't trust every teacher to teach well. The simple fact is, there are good teachers and there are bad teachers. Ultimately, it's the parents job to make sure kids are brought up well. That means helping teach during some years and stepping back more in some years. Parent involvement is a must.

Sometimes parents are unable or unwilling to bring up their kids well. What should happen to those kids?

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#164

Post by gowld »

rayiner wrote: post #107
laurieg wrote: post #58

As someone considering starting a family, I have literally no idea what parenting is anymore. When I was younger I was pretty much left to my own devices, sent off to play with my brother and then packed off to school when old enough. My parents were too busy working, cooking and cleaning to do much fancy extra curricular stuff. I do wonder now what I should be doing to prepare for parenthood. I feel that perhaps it'…

I'm working on kid #2, and my takeaway is this: "parenting science" is like "nutritional science." It's almost entirely bullshit, and little to no progress has been made in the field ever. There is no use paying attention to it, other than doing/not doing the obvious things. (Don't eat too many calories; don't emotionally destroy your kids.) Your kids will turn out how they are going to turn out. Instinctively, you'l…

You just glossed over all the hard, core problems of the field by calling them "obvious", and confusing the great questions of the field with answers for them.

> Don't eat too many calories.

How?

> don't emotionally destroy your kids.

How?

That's like saying "Just follow the law, and you'll have a good life."

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#165

Post by gowld »

war1025 wrote: post #98
smileysteve wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that the books and article argue how present you should be. Which is where the above question comes from. Kids need to fall, need to be able to solve things without parents nearby to be able to grow and make responsible decisions.

I guess to me "Teach them how to be a person" includes letting them make their own mistakes and giving them the space to develop the ability to make responsible decisions.

Two sentences, in, good start sketching the boundaries of the problem space. In 10,000 more sentences you'll start getting into the meaty complexity of these questions.

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#166

Post by gowld »

pnathan wrote: post #65
laurieg wrote: post #58

As someone considering starting a family, I have literally no idea what parenting is anymore. When I was younger I was pretty much left to my own devices, sent off to play with my brother and then packed off to school when old enough. My parents were too busy working, cooking and cleaning to do much fancy extra curricular stuff. I do wonder now what I should be doing to prepare for parenthood. I feel that perhaps it'…

Advice from someone who is a year and a half in: find a volunteer opportunity with the under 3 set, at least weekly, with your partner. The opportunity should include diaper changes and serious interaction with the parents, watching them interact as a triad/dyad with the neonate. Unless you have had regular interaction with the 0-3 set and how people raise them, you won't know what you're getting into, and you won't…

This "volunteer opportunity" was called "living in a family/clan/society" for thousands of years until the weird sterilized suburbanized modern world.

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#167

Post by gowld »

nybble41 wrote: post #152
dragonwriter wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The legal duty which was failed in this case is the duty to not damage others' property. One doesn't have such a duty, otherwise we wouldn't have specific torts at all, you'd just jump straight to damages. > You do have that, right? No, the closest thing to that is general negligence, where you owe a duty of reasonable care. Damages resulting despite exercise of reasonable care (other than where a strict liability…

> No, the closest thing to that is general negligence, where you owe a duty of reasonable care. So your legal system does recognize a duty not to damage others' property. I think it is safe to say that flooding the room is a good example of not taking "reasonable care". > If no breach of a legal duty occurs that produces the accident... Irrelevant, as we've already established that there was a legal duty which was br…

Apparently, this German legal model is that small children are a force of nature, like a tornado or hurricane. That's...one answer, and maybe reasonable in the context of homeowners' insurance and social safety nets, but it's not an indictment of some kind of crazy American helicopter parenting.

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#168

Post by gowld »

conductr wrote: post #72
thorell wrote: post #14

I think a lot of parents don't know how to effectively parent and make up for that with enthusiasm. Too much involvement, not enough parenting. I am guilty of this.

I also think it’s a new form of keeping up with the Jones. Which is why it happens in the privileged set. Stay at home parent? Nanny? Housekeeper? Dad present at all activities? Coaching the team? All things are social signals and increased parental activity is how parents compete with each other.

The fun part of social signals is that you can choose your own. You can hire a nanny and sneer at parents who can't hack high-powered careers, or you can be with your kids and sneer at the gunners who can't raise their own children. Or you can work long days and have no nanny and pass your kid from cousin to uncle to latchkey because you are a normal human being with no time to play status games of the privileged.

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#169

Post by ktsmith »

gowld wrote: post #148
sli wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't say they're ancillary, most of what you said is the claimed benefit of homework (regardless of the correctness of that claim). I'd say you're mostly using the homework as a guide for tutoring, which isn't something that actually requires homework to be assigned by the school if you're willing to be proactive.

Some parents need a little nudge to support their children's education beyond "school is daycare while I work".

You aren't going to find a lot of overlap between homework being done and turned in and parents that view school as daycare.

Re: The 'Over-Parenting Crisis' in School and at Home (2015)

#170

Post by dragonwriter »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #85
btilly wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me turn this around. As a parent, I think that teachers should pay attention to research on homework that says there is on average no academic benefit, but there is a huge cost in family conflict. You have enough time in the classroom to teach and provide practice time. Free family time up for what parents see best.

As a semi-academic, practice supervision sounds like a horrible use of limited teacher/classroom time. But I guess that is true at the high end (in universities and higher performing kids) but not at the lower end where professional practice supervision is much more necessary.

> As a semi-academic, practice supervision sounds like a horrible use of limited teacher/classroom time

Research shows the opposite: lecture is a horrible use of limited teacher/classroom time.

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