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Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

theguardian.com

221–230 of 569 posts

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#221
post #201
post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

9 days in the darkness, with just whatever food they brought in and no way to contact the outside world.

I've read somewhere they thought it was quite shorter than the 9-10 days. Which is the opposite of what I would have thought.

Your circadian cycle gets wacky without sunlight to regulate it.

I've talked to cavers that say they need to set alarm clocks otherwise they will be inside the cave for days without noticing (thinking it's hours), which can be quite dangerous if you're not getting hydrated.

https://books.google.com.br/books?id=8WrmCAAAQBAJ&pg=PA154&l...

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#222
post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you imagine being there for days and days and suddenly a diver pops up?

I assume the diver probably had lights. So at least they had some warning. But yeesh, seriously!

Yeah I can imagine you get visual hallucinations after spending some time in the darkness, so I can imagine they were skeptical seeing lights or hearing things at first. I hope they write a good book about their experiences.

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#223
post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wikipedia is the best website for following: 1. Current events. 2. Sports tournaments. The information entropy level is quite high, with basically no ads, extremely good formatting (relevant tables, charts etc.), and relatively unbiased. This doesn't even mention the benefit of getting simple background information on the subjects with just a simple click (or even a hover these days) It's really a treasure.

I find it even good for medical conditions, condensed history of major events, understanding geography and biography of actors, sportspersons and politicians. Actually, isn't it the * best * first website to learn about anything?

> I find it even good for medical conditions

As in you read several books about a medical condition, and then see what Wikipedia says about it? Because if you just start by reading the Wikipedia article, you'd have no idea whether it's wrong or not. (It's usually wrong.)

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#224
post #66

I wonder if it'd be possible to use some of the momentum and talent from this to mount a rescue attempt to save the children trapped in cages in the United States.

you are being somewhat flippant, but you are getting at something I often wonder about. why is it considered reasonable to spend so much money (and a life) to occasionally rescue a small number of people in a weird predicament? Elon musk was ready to drop about a million dollars on this problem; similarly, I often read about the US Navy retasking entire warships to respond to small maritime emergencies at an hourly c…

I think sometimes we abstract society too much. As always, remember that society is just large numbers of individuals. So why might you decide you want to help people in this sort of situation? It's reasonable to speculate that Musk may have had some of the following major motivators, for instance:

1) It's a fun challenge to try to solve, particularly when traditional solutions seem to be failing.

2) You get to help some people.

3) It's great publicity for you and your companies, particularly if you succeed in an out of the box way.

And other people would have of course have had radically different motivations for why they chose to get involved. There's no grand overseer that found it reasonable to 'spend' or risk a life. It all comes down to completely subjective views, motivations, and value systems. So if you want to know why what any given individual would do is something they would consider reasonable, you would need to ask them. There is no right or wrong answer. In this case the diver's motivations and value determinations convinced him that this was a reasonable spot to risk his life, and he died. I expect he had no regrets and so it was, all things considered, a great way to die from his perspective. By contrast, it would be a terrible way to die from the perspective of many others. Nobody's right, or wrong. It's just different motivations and value determinations.

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#225
post #129
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know what went down but I think he should have asked the people on location what they need. Maybe he did... If he didn't it's just pretty arrogant to spend a little time on a problem you know nothing about and then publicly exclaiming you know a solution. A good idea now would be to send money to the family of the driver who died. That would be helpful.

It's odd that you admit you don't know what went down but are still passing judgement. Even if he did, he didn't interfere or impede rescue efforts and gave them a tool they could possible use in the future. It's cool and a nice thing to do, and doesn't really seem like a big deal.

He did impede rescue efforts if the people on location had to spend even one second on thinking about some half baked solution instead of the task at hand. Why did he do all his stuff in public attracting a lot of attention away from the people risking their lives instead of working on it quietly?

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#226
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, how dare he try to help.

I don't know what went down but I think he should have asked the people on location what they need. Maybe he did... If he didn't it's just pretty arrogant to spend a little time on a problem you know nothing about and then publicly exclaiming you know a solution. A good idea now would be to send money to the family of the driver who died. That would be helpful.

Checked his Twitter feed, he talked with a few persons about their gear and how to help with pumps, power etc. So the sub wasn't the only thing he did.

And yeah, he probably doesn't have all the domain knowledge needed, but I reckon he had some help. Example; the 6 or so people seen on the video when they tested the tube.

I really can't see why people are bashing him. Yes, he was public about it, but he also created something that seems to work, and if it's a prototype, that prototype can be used for further development. It feels like nothing speeds up R&D like a crisis.

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#227
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The amazing part to me is that it was 12 kids and one adult. Between the fear and the biological needs, I wonder what kept them alive for so long. First, the first time I fasted I was quited stressed about it, and it was in controlled, cozy environment. Second, they didn't know if anybody would come. Not even if somebody could come. For 9 days without eating and living in their own shit in the dark, they wondered. I'…

The coach. He shared what little rations they had, and his condition was visibly worse than the children by the time they were found. He also helped them by teaching them meditation, so as not to focus on their hunger.

Let's not forget that the coach was the one who led them into the caves in the first place.

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#228

Thankfully Lord Musk was there to help. Unlike Saman Gunan. In all honesty, please remember and keep repeating Saman Gunan's name. He gave his life for these kids. Musk reused a part of his rocket that his company didn't even build, in a situation where it would never work. It was so obviously a PR stunt it's disgusting. He even personally showed up to the cave site as if he was ever going to actually contribute some…

Elon Musk replied to the BBC report here: https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1016684366083190785

Direct quotes from one of the dive team leads: "please keep working on the capsule" and "it is absolutely worth continuing with the development".

Re: Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully rescued

#229
post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the money and equipment were donated.

While it may be true, not really the point GP was getting after. Cost or donation, can we expect the same for every child in need?

[0] is the first source that popped up on a quick googling; the US alone spent 18 billion dollars between 2002 and 2014 on food aid (to hungry children and such).

[0] http://www.humanosphere.org/world-politics/2014/10/united-st...

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