Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy • Hacker News Board

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#51

Post by throwaway5752 » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:27 PM UTC

Puer wrote: post #34

Next, let's dispel the notion that fat is bad for you. It's the strangest thing to me to see parents feeding their kids "skim milk", which is really just milk flavored water, because whole milk "has fat" and therefore must make their children fat. I only drank whole milk as a kid. A glass with every meal. My parents never bought any juice or soda and me and all of my siblings grew up healthy and strong with no caviti…

That's simply not true about skim milk. It has just as much protein and calcium as whole milk. Maybe you and your siblings would have been even healthier with skim, maybe not, but it's not possible to deduce anything from your experience.

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#52

Post by driverdan » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:27 PM UTC

darkstar999 wrote: post #50

It seems like this article assumes fruit juice. For breakfast I make juice with kale (a bunch), a cucumber, carrots, and an apple. It's a lot healthier than most other American breakfasts.

How much sugar is in it?

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#53

Post by nine_k » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:27 PM UTC

novaRom wrote: post #32

Why not to eat just fruits? Why a kind of juice is necessary?

Juice is way easier to preserve. Also, less messy to consume.

If apples or oranges can last a week in a basket, grapes, or peaches, or many other fruit would not. So it's easy to convince yourself that juice is almost like the fruit, or at least lets you feel some of its pleasant taste.

Like many things, it's higher concentration than our bodies are naturally adapted to, so it's easy to over-consume (a pint instead of a half a cup).

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#54

Post by WilliamEdward » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:28 PM UTC

Gobd wrote: post #9

amasad wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is demonstrably false. No respectable scientist believes in the calories-in-calories-out model of obesity anymore.

What do they believe in now? I still thought calorie-in/out was the truth. I'd love to see some articles.

Be wary anytime someone mentions "scientists" in their argument. More than likely OP has no source. Nevertheless, I get his point. Basically, calorie-in/out is still very much used but it doesn't tell the full story. At the end of the day you will gain weight if you eat too many Calories, but eating an apple will make you feel fuller than a chocolate bar, etc. Scientists dont even have a stake in this really it's more like nutritionists, and the jury is out as to whether we can call them scientists.

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#55

Post by gnicholas » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:28 PM UTC

forgotpwagain wrote: post #37

sm64 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To add, the "no sugar added" thing is wholly misleading because there are fruit concentrates that companies can add that are basically sugar substitutes. It's technically not "sugar added" but it's basically filled with healthy dollop of fructose (which is worse than sucrose but I'm too lazy to cite a reference).

Grape juice is the notorious one here. It doesn't have a very strong taste on its own, so when blended basically serves as a not-technically-added-sugar source of added sugar.

I recently saw a ginger-flavored carbonated that boasted of the percent juice. I was surprised by the number (30%?), and when I looked at the ingredients I saw that the juice was not mostly ginger. It was grape juice.

I understand that when I see “cranberry cocktail”, there’s a bunch of sweet juice mixed in. I didn’t realize that drinks of other flavors have so much clandestine grape juice — which is basically sugar.

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#56

Post by skj » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:29 PM UTC

daturkel wrote: post #48

kareemm wrote: post #13

I love the strange looks we get when we tell extended family that our 1.5y old and 4y old kids don't drink juice. I had this exact conversation with a cousin of mine last week. She checked in with me before giving my child juice. When I told her we didn't give our kids juice this is how the conversation went: Q: "They don't drink juice? What do they drink?" A: "Water." Q: "Just water?" A: "Yep. If you want to get fan…

Your last note about kids being wired on sugar, while pervasive and seemingly anecdotally supported, has not been proven out in the literature. Sugar has not been conclusively found to cause hyperactivity.

My son goes nuts when he has sugar (like ice cream or a cupcake), full stop.

Has it not been shown in the literature because no one has tried an appropriately rigorous experiment, or because the appropriately rigorous experiment showed a different conclusion?

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#57

Post by maxxxxx » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:29 PM UTC

novaRom wrote: post #32

Why not to eat just fruits? Why a kind of juice is necessary?

It seems people are trained to believe that food always needs some kind of processing. I often eat raw bell peppers and tomato pieces at work and judging from the comments people seem to never even have thought of that as possibility.

Right now the best are bottled teas like "Honest Tea" for $3 a pop at lunch. You can get something much better by buying some nice tea and brewing it yourself. And it probably costs only 5 cents instead of $3.

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#58

Post by _wmd » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:29 PM UTC

daturkel wrote: post #48

kareemm wrote: post #13

I love the strange looks we get when we tell extended family that our 1.5y old and 4y old kids don't drink juice. I had this exact conversation with a cousin of mine last week. She checked in with me before giving my child juice. When I told her we didn't give our kids juice this is how the conversation went: Q: "They don't drink juice? What do they drink?" A: "Water." Q: "Just water?" A: "Yep. If you want to get fan…

Your last note about kids being wired on sugar, while pervasive and seemingly anecdotally supported, has not been proven out in the literature. Sugar has not been conclusively found to cause hyperactivity.

Ignoring the lunacy of wasting decades of training to prove (I hope, to everyone) the blindingly obvious, this would potentially be a real fun experiment to design.

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#59

Post by westiseast » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:29 PM UTC

novaRom wrote: post #32

Why not to eat just fruits? Why a kind of juice is necessary?

Because juice tastes good. Fruit tastes good, and juice is a 10x more cool, watery, refreshing, and sweet. Anyone who says chugging a half litre of cold apple juice after a long run isn’t heaven on earth is dead inside.

Re: Seriously, Juice Is Not Healthy

#60

Post by maxerickson » Sat, Jul 07, 2018, 10:29 PM UTC

dangrossman wrote: post #38

DanAndersen wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>But in most cases, they quickly gain it back. So they gain it back once they stop being on calorie-restricted diets? This isn't a surprise to anyone. The point of any of these things, CICO or otherwise, is that you do them for your lifetime as a lifestyle change.

We have a century of evidence that calorie restriction is not a diet people can stay on. I just sourced this above. Calorie restriction alone while eating fast food, soda, cake, etc is a diet of chronic hunger/deprivation, and "become a monk with an iron will until your death" is not a reasonable "lifestyle change" to suggest. That's why "just count calories" is not the advice any respectable scientist would give an…

But to sustain a weight loss you basically do have to eat less, forever. I say this being 60 pounds below my highest weight (200 vs 260).

Someone is talking about protein conversion, but I expect it is just harder to eat excess calories of meat. The 2 pounds of beef a day it would take many people to maintain body weight is a lot of beef to sit and eat.