Live data from Hacker News

Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

npr.org

161–170 of 186 posts

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#161

Interesting would be the view of "How we sleep after consuming marihuana".

In his podcast, he talks about that with Seth Rogen. Turns out that marihuana as well as alcohol induces sedation rather than sleep.

This causes the brain to withhold REM sleep until the sedative has worn off, then suddenly catches up. So lots of people report very vivid dreams at the end of the night.

Since the amount of REM sleep was less, the quality of the sleep is also lower (he said only half or so).

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lose weight and most likely you will stop snoring. Most likely you are obese or overweight.

Stop giving out unsolicited, ignorant, mistargeted medical advice.

Addicted people—-including food addicts—-never want to hear the truth. And the pro-obesity movement costs society greatly.

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#163
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suffered from obstructive sleep apnea (OSA) and snoring, and the two things that helped were sleeping on my side and weight loss. The latter was difficult to achieve but was the most high-leverage thing I ever did. I had no idea at the time, but my OSA was contributing to a slew of health problems like hypertension etc., and when I removed the cause, my overall health got better.

Exactly. The need for a CPAP is almost always mitigated by weight loss.

That's all fine and well when OSA is the problem, but many people suffer from central sleep apnea and that has nothing to do with weight. Saying weight loss can mitigate the need "almost always" is an exaggeration at best.

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#164
post #84
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they are. You'll learn less in your sleep deprived states, Which are days you aren't going to get back. Your sleep deprived self will also be better at creating tech debt, which takes away time from the future.

> You'll learn less in your sleep deprived states, Which are days you aren't going to get back. That's not what a description of what the professor says in the article, or the way we mean it. Of course you won't get "chances to learn" or "tech debt" back. This is not about it. TFA talks about a physiological debt that you can't repay.

I don't know how to measure the physiological debt, and the person asking the question was not sold on the physiological debt.

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#165

Interesting would be the view of "How we sleep after consuming marihuana".

In his podcast, he talks about that with Seth Rogen. Turns out that marihuana as well as alcohol induces sedation rather than sleep. This causes the brain to withhold REM sleep until the sedative has worn off, then suddenly catches up. So lots of people report very vivid dreams at the end of the night. Since the amount of REM sleep was less, the quality of the sleep is also lower (he said only half or so).

That would be Joe Rogan. Link to the podcast is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwaWilO_Pig.

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4) No one gives a shit about the long term health effects. There are lots of pieces of knowledge that have obvious practical implications that aren’t acted upon because it’s inconvenient and the function of a system is different from what people say it’s for. School is more childcare than education and using the same buses for elementary and high school is cheaper so all high school students are sleep deprived and le…

Can you explain more about forgetting curve and direct instruction?

Forgetting curve means it's better to learn about independent topics (in lets say philosophy) A B C in the order ABCABCABC, but almost in every school it would be AAABBBCCC.

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain more about forgetting curve and direct instruction?

Forgetting curve means it's better to learn about independent topics (in lets say philosophy) A B C in the order ABCABCABC, but almost in every school it would be AAABBBCCC.

In a bit more detail, the basic idea is that forgetting is a regular, valuable occurance to have better access to the useful information and the way that useful information is determined is use over time. If you use particular information intensely over a short period of time then stop using it at all, that is a signal that you are done with that information and it will be forgotten fairly quickly. But if you use it again after a while then that is a signal that it might be useful even further into the future. Spaced repetition is another application of this idea.

I've always liked B.F. Skinner's ideas about learning, where the forgetting curve is paired with the idea that making mistakes is quite harmful since then we also have the memory of the incorrect answer (that will decay more slowly than random information due to being close to the thing we want to actually use). So it is better to refer to the correct answer until you can recall it correctly, which happens automatically as a standard brain optimization when we do something repeatedly.

I don't really know anything about direct instruction, but it sounds like a core idea is heavily scripted teacher student interaction, which sounds even more dystopian to me than the current system (like being raised by an automated call center in human form). But IMO a bit further in that direction would be great. Remove teachers from the normal learning loop and provide a variety of learning materals (books, video, audio). Teachers can then assist students individually and spend more time being social workers or whatever else is needed so that kids are in a place to be able to learn. Currently the whole school experience tends towards performance art by teachers where the presence or absence of students is a secondary concern. If learning was the important part then the experience would be centered around learning with the presence or absence of teachers a secondary concern.

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#168

I've read a lot about sleep over the years (and wrote a bit [2]), but I just finished reading the book mentioned in the article ("Why We Sleep" [1]) and found it fascinating . The author presents a vast amount of scientific evidence amount pretty much every corner of why we sleep, from its evolutionary roots thousands of years ago, to the importance of dreams and REM sleep for your memory, reasons and impact of insom…

Looks really interesting; I've just started listening to the audiobook.

Also, while I obviously haven't listened to this audiobook yet, it's read by Steve West, and I have listened to him narrate audiobooks before. He's great; very easy to listen to in my experience. Obviously tastes can vary (e.g. he has an English accent, which I'm sure some people won't like).

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#169
post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I've read, weight loss almost always helps (assuming a person is obese, which is common with OSA because it's also a symptom), but it's unusual for it to totally eliminate the need for CPAP.

I experienced the reverse: using a CPAP finally gave me enough energy to start exercising, which helped me lose weight. I imagine if I stopped using the CPAP I would slowly start losing energy again and probably stop exercising and gain the weight back. The few nights I've gone without CPAP have left me feeling awful, even without as much weight.

Everyone's physiology differs, but I've learned that weight control is 80% diet and 20% physical activity. (this assumes normal metabolism)

I went to the gym for years and my weight fluctuated a couple of pounds. Cardio was especially ineffective for any kind of weight loss.

Weights were much more effective because they increased my resting metabolism. I drastically reduced carbs from my diet, increased protein and vegetables, and the needle on the scale started moving. I ate about the same amount, but I changed the composition of my food -- no simple sugars or simple carbs.

I don't want to be prescriptive, since everyone's different, but for anyone who finds it hard to adopt an exercise routine, I would encourage them to consider changing their diets and see if that makes a difference.

Re: Sleep Scientist Warns Against Walking Through Life 'In an Underslept State'

#170
post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We actually do celebrate athletes' physical sacrifices. Think marathon runners pushing across the finish line, or a running back selling out for the touchdown. It's probably something wired into us as human beings. Just a side note. Your analogy is on point and helpful.

> We actually do celebrate athletes' physical sacrifices. I'm not certain that's quite accurate. It seems that what's celebrated are their accomplishments and "sacrifices" in the sense of effort and self-denial, but not injuries. The sentiment around brain injuries that professional boxers (and, more recently, American Football players) suffer from isn't what I would characterize as celebratory, for example. Even tem…

That concussion sentiment is very, very recent. Hard hits in football and boxing were absolutely celebrated as a show of dominance. They still are, just with obligatory lip service paid to hoping the player is ok.

I don't think disdain is the right word. Disappointment can certainly come into play, but look at any serious injury on the court or the field. What happens when the player is able to limp off, or is even carried off? Applause, sometimes a standing ovation, for the player's physical sacrifice.

I believe this is tied into the same primal urges that make us love a compelling war movie (we used to celebrate war much more than we now do as well), or want to work 16 hour days for the chance at striking it rich.

Post reply on HN