Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE • Hacker News Board

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#41

Post by drb91 » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:30 AM UTC

staticautomatic wrote: post #36

kojon99 wrote: post #14

I’m not American and I’ve always found it fascinating how a part of the American population defends the existence of illegal immigrants in American soil. It’s crazy.

It's a country founded by immigrants and for much of its history it welcomed them (with some significant caveats). The assertion that America is only for people who are already here is both radical and relatively recent. That's what's crazy.

> The assertion that America is only for people who are already here is both radical and relatively recent. That's what's crazy.

Well, to be fair, most immigration policy can be traced to blatantly racist policies, for instance against people of chinese descent.

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#42

Post by lovich » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:31 AM UTC

cityhomesteader wrote: post #24

ve55 wrote: post #4

>Microsoft has been positioning itself as tech’s moral leader. Mr. Nadella and Microsoft’s president, Brad Smith, have publicly said they want to protect user privacy Hard to take this seriously given what Windows 10 and other new microsoft products subject users to.

Lately, it's been hard to take anything from the media seriously. It's strange how the media has been treating microsoft with kid gloves while wailing on facebook. It's a constant battle with windows 10. You could remove apps, update registry/configs, disable as much telemetry as possible but you never know what the monthly update is going undo. Not to mention the differences options you have for Home, Professional,…

It says a lot about the industry. We are not a bunch of scrappy outsiders disrupting businesses anymore. Its turned into a bunch of psychopaths at the head who do anything for money.

We are as bad as Wall Street now

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#43

Post by sanderjd » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:32 AM UTC

kojon99 wrote: post #14

I’m not American and I’ve always found it fascinating how a part of the American population defends the existence of illegal immigrants in American soil. It’s crazy.

tldr: I'll be in favor of cracking down on illegal immigrants when people stop hiring them for fear of getting in trouble.

This is a naive reading of the politics. Very few people are actively in favor of illegal immigration. Many people believe the cures (that is, the ones that politicians push for) are worse than the disease. My personal view is that if we really wanted to solve the problem, we would do it on the economic side; there are whole sectors of our economy that everyone knows are propped up by the employment of illegal immigrants. Nobody talks about that because the people who benefit most are strong, organized, and relatable (upstanding well-to-do businesspeople). Instead, everyone goes after the weak, disorganized, and unrelatable (scary foreigners who don't even speak our language).

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#44

Post by popularrecluse » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:32 AM UTC

kojon99 wrote: post #14

I’m not American and I’ve always found it fascinating how a part of the American population defends the existence of illegal immigrants in American soil. It’s crazy.

Yeah well I am American and it's not true. The majority of us who you have been made to believe 'defend' their residing here illegally want to see them treated humanely, and see sensible immigration reform and reasonable paths to citizenship for those who desire it.

I know, and have worked with plenty of people whose papers weren't in order. They are people, just like you or me. I certainly have violated the law in my life, and perhaps with less noble intentions than seeking a better life in another country.

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#45

Post by wildmusings » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:33 AM UTC

i_dont_know_ wrote: post #30

kojon99 wrote: post #14

I’m not American and I’ve always found it fascinating how a part of the American population defends the existence of illegal immigrants in American soil. It’s crazy.

I think you're getting it very wrong; this isn't about people saying "let's just allow illegal immigrants the full rights of legal immigrants". There are some people saying that, but they're a small minority. This is about saying "some people have come here illegally. let's not psychologically torture their children for it" You can be for legal migration and the humane treatment of people at the same time.

This is such a distortion of what’s happening. Crossing into the US illegally is a crime. We are now arresting and charging people who commit it. We do not send innocent children to prison, so the only option is separation.

If you commit any other crime and are arrested, you will be “separated” from your child, because your child does not belong in prison. Why do you expect this to be any different?

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#46

Post by krapp » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:34 AM UTC

ginger123 wrote: post #35

_bohm wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really? Most people I know would probably contend that the illegal status of most of these people is due to flaws in our immigration system. They want this country to be a place where from all over can come to thrive if they are so motivated. The quote engraved on the Statue of Liberty comes to mind... “Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teem…

Are you ok if illegals immigrants move into your neighborhood and compete for your job? EDIT: Why am I being downvoted? I asked a legitimate question. If illegal immigrants moved into your neighborhood and affected the socioeconomic status, school ratings etc of your neighborhood, how will you react? Will you advocate for the same policies you are advocating now? I have a feeling most of the people who are supporting…

It's not the fault of illegal immigrants that American companies are willing to hire them.

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#47

Post by patrickg_zill » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:34 AM UTC

It would be entirely expected and likely, that were MSFT to cancel their ICE contract, that many other parts of the Federal government would leave MSFT's services.

After all, they too would be only 1 media dustup away from having to deal with finding another vendor suddenly.

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#48

Post by wildmusings » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:34 AM UTC

popularrecluse wrote: post #44

kojon99 wrote: post #14

I’m not American and I’ve always found it fascinating how a part of the American population defends the existence of illegal immigrants in American soil. It’s crazy.

Yeah well I am American and it's not true. The majority of us who you have been made to believe 'defend' their residing here illegally want to see them treated humanely, and see sensible immigration reform and reasonable paths to citizenship for those who desire it. I know, and have worked with plenty of people whose papers weren't in order. They are people, just like you or me. I certainly have violated the law in m…

“Papers weren’t in order” is a hell of a euphemism for crossing into the country illegally or overstaying a temporary visa that is explicitly not for migration.

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#49

Post by ginger123 » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:34 AM UTC

popularrecluse wrote: post #44

kojon99 wrote: post #14

I’m not American and I’ve always found it fascinating how a part of the American population defends the existence of illegal immigrants in American soil. It’s crazy.

Yeah well I am American and it's not true. The majority of us who you have been made to believe 'defend' their residing here illegally want to see them treated humanely, and see sensible immigration reform and reasonable paths to citizenship for those who desire it. I know, and have worked with plenty of people whose papers weren't in order. They are people, just like you or me. I certainly have violated the law in m…

What kind of work do you do?

Re: Microsoft Employees Protest Work with ICE

#50

Post by estebank » Wed, Jun 20, 2018, 1:35 AM UTC

joelrunyon wrote: post #33

nemothekid wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because in the US, and unlike Brazil, Voter ID laws are specifically enacted to discourage people from voting. It’s a solution looking for a problem (voter fraud is hardly an issue in the US). The Voter ID laws are all about putting a barrier in place to prevent $DEMOGRAPHIC from voting, then making it exceedingly difficult for $DEMOGRAPHIC to pass that barrier, even though it’s well within $DEMOGRAPHIC right to vote…

> Because in the US, and unlike Brazil, Voter ID laws are specifically enacted to discourage people from voting. How familiar are you with the voting laws in Brazil and the reasoning behind them?

I'm familiar with the laws in Argentina. Brazil has similar laws and reason behind them. A very big difference is that the US doesn't have a national ID to begin with, and a substantial portion of the population would not support the creation of one. Argentina and Brazil provide a national ID to every newborn that is needed for any interaction with the state. Furthermore, procuring a state ID in the US can be difficult for some citizens, as the documentation that would be required for it (usually birth certificates) was purposely "misplaced" due to explicitly racist policies.