Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Habits of Highly Miserable People

alternet.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

291–300 of 321 posts

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#291

Post by techsin101 »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #120
RIMR wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know this is a bit of a controversial opinion, but I always felt that society's reaction to sexual assault give victims a reason to feel even worse about their situation. Not to say that it isn't a severely traumatic thing to experience - it absolutely is. But, we regularly treat virginity as some sort of virtuous status - and then speak of rape victims who lost their virginity to their attacker as if they were str…

I agree with you. I have often gotten reactions of pity and the like for speaking openly of my experiences. I do my best to give polite push back against it. I was raised with the idea that the shame is on the rapist, not the victim. I was raised with the idea that people who treat the victim in a shaming way are part of the problem. Being open about this aspect of my life is probably the single most "political" thin…

This is similar to how when men are corced into sex then it's seen as a dream come true by a lot of people, and often many such men also feel lucky themselves. But for women it become the script of what they're and everyone feels she has been wronged.

Just due to perspective in culture one see event as achievement and other as permanent assault, even though both had same circumstances

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#292

Post by dwaltrip »

lapnitnelav wrote: post #262
dwaltrip wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You seem to be assuming the mindset that nothing matters after an individual dies. I'm sure you are not surprised to hear that many disagree with this.

To that specific individual, it doesn't because they are dead. As for what happens in the realm of death, we'll see when we get there.

> To that specific individual, it doesn't because they are dead.

I wasn't clear enough. The decisions one makes during their life are affected by whether or not they care about anything that happens after they are dead (any many specifics beyond that). Many people do things whose primary impact won't be felt until long after they are gone. So it isn't true to simply say that nothing matters after the individual is dead.

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#293

Post by swampers »

foxhill wrote: post #71

having been, for want of a better term, ‘highly miserable’ in the past, the entirety of this article comes across as insidiously toxic and detrimental to the mental well-being of those who are suffering. there is a.. loosely similar CGP Grey video, which approaches the matter in a much more rational context [1] for anyone suffering, i emplore you to not read this and watch this instead; [1] - https://youtube.com/watc…

I similarly didn't appreciate this approach. It pillories those who think like this, whether that's within their control or not.

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#294

Post by Felz »

RickS wrote: post #218
Felz wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bravery debate, in other words. http://slatestarcodex.com/2013/06/09/all-debates-are-bravery... There are probably people who really need to hear "your problems are real and you should get help" and also those who need to hear "your problems are mainly self inflicted and you need to deal". This article gives the same advice for both types, and that's pretty dangerous.

That was a hugely useful read, thank you! It fits perfectly. A former coworker of mine recently recommended The Subtle Art of Not Giving A Fuck. She said she read it in my voice. I couldn't stand it, and I couldn't figure out the source of the dissonance. She needed the thing I do. I need the thing she does (give more fucks). We can't read and grow from the same books. Really useful mental model here. I'd be interest…

I wish I could be more help for good reads. Unfortunately, I tend not to write them down, and the best stuff only sinks in later.

SSC is usually fairly interesting for stuff like though, which is why I can remember to link it. For example, later post on the same topic:

http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/03/24/should-you-reverse-any-...

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#295

Post by Felz »

elipsey wrote: post #248
Felz wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a bravery debate, in other words. http://slatestarcodex.com/2013/06/09/all-debates-are-bravery... There are probably people who really need to hear "your problems are real and you should get help" and also those who need to hear "your problems are mainly self inflicted and you need to deal". This article gives the same advice for both types, and that's pretty dangerous.

Yes, I know this article too, and I apologize for the collateral annoying-ness of my comment. I knew I was stepping in one of those, but it’s not what I came in here for. The downside of being ill-advised in this way is exceptionally, asymmetrically, high for certain people (and maybe anyone standing next to them). That’s who I was talking to. If you had seen what I've seen you might regretfully do the same. Best reg…

Absolutely. I actually agree with you- this is playing with fire- I just thought it'd be helpful to point out the general dilemma.

This is sort of awkward on HN, because there's a culture of stoic self-reliance that's very helpful for, well, startups. "Create your own destiny" and "you don't have to bear the burden alone" don't mix well.

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#296

Post by scarejunba »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #193
dwcnnnghm wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also the basis of the Steel Man Argument [0] [1], as opposed to Straw-manning. Instead of attacking (basically nitpicking) the easy missteps in your opponent's reasoning, find the best form of their argument, and then argue with this. It seems to me as the ideal way to both win over those on the other side and provide yourself with a solid ground. You present yourself as avoiding undermining their position (r…

The strawman can be stripped down gradually to find the truth. The steel man locks the truth somewhere inside; and one doesn't look in case ones conversational partner feels offended by being wrong. Of course you can't tell me I'm wrong; because you have to give my argument the best possible interpretation even if it doesn't deserve it ...!

I’m not interested in telling you you’re wrong. You being wrong is your problem. I’m interested in my being right. If I can extract some information from our conversation that moves me to a better understanding of things then I have done all right from the interaction (assuming the time involved is short). The steel man allows me to extract this information from the interaction.

In practice, if someone isn’t capable of using the information I provide to re-assess their position, continued interaction is likely to be low quality. This isn’t a fault thing. It could just be that I’m incapable of interacting reasonably with this person. Either way, it’s then time to disengage.

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#297

Post by scarejunba »

yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #210
ModernMech wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"14. Be critical. Make sure to have an endless list of dislikes and voice them often, whether or not your opinion is solicited. For example, don’t hesitate to say, “That’s what you chose to wear this morning?” or “Why is your voice so shrill?” If someone is eating eggs, tell them you don’t like eggs. Your negativity can be applied to almost anything."

You can, for instance, object to perfectly valid criticisms. How dare this person question legibility!

This is a solved problem. Adjust your user agent.

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#298

Post by scarejunba »

bambax wrote: post #28

> Have an affair (...) Don't enjoy life's pleasures So... which is it? > Taking pleasure in things like food, wine, music, and beauty is for flighty, shallow people. Why is sex not listed in "life's pleasures"?

Personally, I’m horrifically offended that skydiving and slacklining wasn’t listed there either.

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#299

Post by joshumax »

snarfy wrote: post #266
RIMR wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know this is a bit of a controversial opinion, but I always felt that society's reaction to sexual assault give victims a reason to feel even worse about their situation. Not to say that it isn't a severely traumatic thing to experience - it absolutely is. But, we regularly treat virginity as some sort of virtuous status - and then speak of rape victims who lost their virginity to their attacker as if they were str…

As a male, people told me I'm a liar and that it's not possible to be raped by a female. I don't bother bringing it up anymore.

I have had similar responses on occasion when I bring up what happened to me in Jr. High with a sub. Eventually I decided that waiting for stigma and toxic ideologies to disappear from society wasn't the best use of my time. Instead I decided to start a charity against sexual assault and focus on healing through a positive outlet.

Re: Habits of Highly Miserable People

#300

Post by jtmb »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #120
RIMR wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know this is a bit of a controversial opinion, but I always felt that society's reaction to sexual assault give victims a reason to feel even worse about their situation. Not to say that it isn't a severely traumatic thing to experience - it absolutely is. But, we regularly treat virginity as some sort of virtuous status - and then speak of rape victims who lost their virginity to their attacker as if they were str…

I agree with you. I have often gotten reactions of pity and the like for speaking openly of my experiences. I do my best to give polite push back against it. I was raised with the idea that the shame is on the rapist, not the victim. I was raised with the idea that people who treat the victim in a shaming way are part of the problem. Being open about this aspect of my life is probably the single most "political" thin…

How would you recommend expressing support, not minimizing these experiences while also not assuming victimization?
Post reply on HN