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Apple introduces macOS Mojave

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Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#341

Post by moosingin3space »

ryandrake wrote: post #177
0x0 wrote: post #33

Wow, they are DEPRECATING OpenGL from both macOS and iOS: https://developer.apple.com/macos/whats-new/ This is in addition to last year's announcement that "macOS High Sierra is the last version of macOS to run 32bit apps without compromise " I wonder if we will soon see a new lineage of Macbooks fitted with Apple-specific arm64 chips. The most scary thought is if UIKit-on-macOS starts requiring Developer ID entitlem…

I guess we will be saying our last goodbye to “write once, run on all major platforms” graphics code. Does this mean that the only choices now are 1. Fork your graphics code into two separate implementations or 2. Go up the stack and use a cross-platform “game” engine like Unity? I suppose 3. Stop supporting macOS is another (sad) option.

If you're programming in Rust, you can just use `gfx-rs`'s HAL[1]. This is designed to be a Vulkan-like API that works on top of Vulkan, Metal, D3D12, or OpenGL.

If you aren't in Rust, just use Vulkan. There are high-performance wrappers for it in various stages of development, such as MoltenVK[2] for macOS and iOS, and VulkanOnD3D12[3] for UWP. Non-UWP Windows, Linux, and Android should support Vulkan natively through their GPU drivers.

[1]: https://github.com/gfx-rs/gfx

[2]: https://github.com/KhronosGroup/MoltenVK

[3]: https://github.com/Chabloom/VulkanOnD3D12

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#342

Post by Reason077 »

0x0 wrote: post #33

Wow, they are DEPRECATING OpenGL from both macOS and iOS: https://developer.apple.com/macos/whats-new/ This is in addition to last year's announcement that "macOS High Sierra is the last version of macOS to run 32bit apps without compromise " I wonder if we will soon see a new lineage of Macbooks fitted with Apple-specific arm64 chips. The most scary thought is if UIKit-on-macOS starts requiring Developer ID entitlem…

"Also, r.i.p. my old macbook air 2011 :-/"

macOS performance was already getting so poor on 2010/2011 MacBook Airs, so I think this is the right move. I recently downgraded my old 2GB 2010 MacBook Air back to 10.11 El Capitan and it runs much, much better than it did on High Sierra.

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#343

Post by vvanders »

rys wrote: post #337
vvanders wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wat. Metal and OpenGL two completely different APIs, shading languages and probably a whole host of other things. I've ported my fair share of things from fixed-function to programmable shader pipelines and you'd be effing naive if you think you can do that in a couple weeks on anything more than a toy demo.

I worked with a AAA gamedev recently who had written a Vulkan renderer for their game to demo quality level in 2 weeks. It all depends on existing level of abstraction for the rendering API and shading language (and to some extent assets), and how much performance and efficiency you’re happy leaving on the table.

> demo quality level in 2 weeks

Getting pixels on the screen and shipping something to end users are to very, very different things, 90/10 rule and all that.

Vulkan also has the benefit of multiple platforms supporting it so you're not doing all that work for a minority(which is what OSX is in the graphics space) platform.

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#344

Post by jdietrich »

engi_nerd wrote: post #112
jcfrei wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Always interesting to see the divergence between HN and what the average user cares about. For most people emojis (and animojis) have opened a whole new way to communicate with each other. I can't think of another linguistic feature in history which saw such widespread use within a decade and I feel like emojis don't get enough credit for that.

How is an emoji a whole new way to communicate? EDIT: I meant this as a genuine question, not as a "how could you possibly think this" response.

I don't mean this to sound in any way cruel or judgemental, but a very large proportion of the population have very limited literacy skills. Emoji are useful for all users who are writing short, personal messages that might be ambiguous in tone. They are extremely useful for people who would otherwise struggle to express or understand tone and emotion using the written word.

In the last National Assessment of Adult Literacy, 43% of Americans were assessed as having "basic or below basic" literacy. They can extract basic factual information from short, straightforward texts, but little more than that.

Here are a couple of example questions from that test.

Only 33% of Americans could describe what is expressed in the following poem:

"The pedigree of honey Does not concern the Bee - A clover, any time, to him Is Aristocracy"

Either a literal or thematic description of the poem constitutes an acceptable answer.

Read the text at the link below. After reading this text, only 16% of Americans could describe the purpose of the Se Habla Español expo.

https://nces.ed.gov/NAAL/sample_imgtxtequiv.asp?Imageid=164

Acceptable answers include any statement such as the following: "to enable people to better serve and sell to the Hispanic community", "to improve marketing strategies to the Hispanic community" and "to enable people to establish contacts to serve the Hispanic community".

Did you get the right answer? 84% of Americans didn't. Bear that in mind when you're writing documentation or dialog boxes.

https://www.nngroup.com/articles/writing-for-lower-literacy-...

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#345

Post by jodrellblank »

sologoub wrote: post #229
mistersquid wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My significant other suffers from depression. We are long distance and much of our daily communication is through text-messaging. We both rely on this one emoji to communicate more effectively: [0] We use others, but that one emoji makes all the difference in the world. Often we send only that single sign to each other. [0] https://emojipedia.org/smiling-face-with-smiling-eyes/ EDIT: Replace emoji with text descripti…

Very curious - what do you think makes the image version superior to the text-based smiley? And as a follow-on, do you think the animated and personalized versions of these emojis make it that much more effective? For me, the text version communicates the same meaning and context, so it’s fascinating to see examples where the representational medium has a significant impact.

This smiling-face-with-smiling-eyes is one of the few emoji that cause an automatic emotional response inside me. Another is https://emojipedia.org/loudly-crying-face/ (Apple rendition of both, particularly).

Text, and ASCII emoticons, just don't do that.

(and I'm guessing that after I see enough "we can save you money on your car insurance :smiling_face_with_smiling_eyes: manipulative overuse by marketing "humans", emojis won't do it anymore either).

(Although, do you genuinely think a photo of a cat being cute is emotionally the same and just as effective as a description of a cat being cute?)

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#346

Post by TillE »

saagarjha wrote: post #210
Eric_WVGG wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just quibbling, but 1) you can write Metal code with Swift as well as Objective-C (and that's not even vendor-locked; I'm doing Swift in Linux right now), and 2) you can write C++ in Objective-C. I know this isn't what you're really complaining about, though.

> you can write C++ in Objective-C You mean Objective-C++.

The most common pattern I've seen with cross-platform stuff is a small Objective-C wrapper over MacOS APIs, which then gets called like C functions from pure C++ code.

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#347

Post by seba_dos1 »

rys wrote: post #337
vvanders wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wat. Metal and OpenGL two completely different APIs, shading languages and probably a whole host of other things. I've ported my fair share of things from fixed-function to programmable shader pipelines and you'd be effing naive if you think you can do that in a couple weeks on anything more than a toy demo.

I worked with a AAA gamedev recently who had written a Vulkan renderer for their game to demo quality level in 2 weeks. It all depends on existing level of abstraction for the rendering API and shading language (and to some extent assets), and how much performance and efficiency you’re happy leaving on the table.

If you already had an architecture with replaceable renderers, especially with DirectX 12 one already written, adding Vulkan one will be a matter of just a few weeks. If you hadn't, it will be much tougher.

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#348

Post by vortico »

0x0 wrote: post #33

Wow, they are DEPRECATING OpenGL from both macOS and iOS: https://developer.apple.com/macos/whats-new/ This is in addition to last year's announcement that "macOS High Sierra is the last version of macOS to run 32bit apps without compromise " I wonder if we will soon see a new lineage of Macbooks fitted with Apple-specific arm64 chips. The most scary thought is if UIKit-on-macOS starts requiring Developer ID entitlem…

Nice marketing campaign here a couple years ago. https://developer.apple.com/opencl/

Make up your fucking minds. Developers aren't hamsters.

I now declare MacOS to be deprecated, if that's how it's going to be.

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#349

Post by TillE »

s73v3r_ wrote: post #274
shurcooL wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Riot probably has enough resources to pay its developers to target Metal on macOS by the time OpenGL is removed (some number of years from now). It’s the smaller scale developers and projects that might not have have such ability.

The smaller scale ones are generally using an existing engine like Unity or Unreal, which handles Metal support.

Generally, yes. Certainly not all. The likes of SFML and SDL2 and libgdx have zero support for Metal, although SDL2 did recently add support for Vulkan.

Re: Apple introduces macOS Mojave

#350

Post by [deleted] »

obl wrote: post #144
electricslpnsld wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> DEPRECATING OpenGL Wow, does this mean Maya, Houdini, and basically every 3D package out there will no longer run on macOS? If so that seriously sucks for 3D pros.

I'm guessing it's not the end of the world for Autodesk to add a metal backend to maya. Some smaller teams might very well choose to let go of mac though.

[deleted]
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