Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store • Hacker News Board

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#131

Post by Casseres » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:42 PM UTC

peterkelly wrote: post #116

Casseres wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It should be built into the initial price. And perpetual is unrealistic, but 10 years is not. Microsoft provides 5 years of Mainstream Support and 5 years of Extended Support at no additional cost (cost is built into the initial license fee). Heck, I would more trust software that says 10 years of garunteed support rather than lifetime support. Too many companies fudge the meaning of "lifetime", and 10 years blows Go…

> Microsoft provides 5 years of Mainstream Support and 5 years of Extended Support at no additional cost (cost is built into the initial license fee). For Windows perhaps, but they sell Office as a yearly subscription.

They also sell it with a perpetual license. I own licenses for Office 2003, 2007, 2013, and 2016.

(Office 2016 works well on Linux with Crossover. Just bought a Crossover lifetime license. Crossover has a decent subscription/license working - subscription is for updates, you can continue using indefinately if you stop paying. Although it is a little expensive.)

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#132

Post by Pulcinella » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:46 PM UTC

makecheck wrote: post #103

There are at least two elements to software maintenance: one is adding truly new features, and the other is making stupid changes just to keep old features working as they always did (often due to platform or hardware changes, especially with Apple!). I see Apple coughing up none of the costs that they create by regularly fiddling with their platforms and hardware in breaking ways, yet that is a big reason why softwa…

Yes. I feel that, because of the currently constantly changing nature of hardware and software platforms, subscriptions are going to be the only way of sustaining a business. It’s no longer even software as a service, but software IS a service.

The only exceptions are situations where hardware and platforms change slowly or not at all. e.g. Single player video games (and even that is largely consoles), certain kinds of embedded, etc.

People are already becoming frustrated with all the subscriptions they have, though. People are “fine” with paying to maintain things like their home and car. The problem with software is that it doesn’t really “break” from use. Updating the platform and hardware around the software is what can break it. It would be like the pipes in your home are indestructible and never burst in winter, but they can explode when building codes update or the water treatment plant changes it’s equipment.

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#133

Post by gergles » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:47 PM UTC

hannibalhorn wrote: post #17

spv wrote: post #5

I have been using Bitwarden for some time now. It’s an open source password manager. There are apps for all major platforms and extensions to all major browsers. Checkout https://bitwarden.com/

Interesting in that you can host your own instance of their cloud server, but I really prefer something that uses standard cloud storage mechanisms (Dropbox, iCloud, etc.) for sync and works on top of that. Like others here, I'll probably be reevaluating my choice when it feels like it's time to upgrade. For me, some of the open source solutions are perfect as far as the underlying storage format and sync technology,…

I use Enpass for this, which uses any kind of regular cloud storage backend and has a fully-featured desktop client and browser fill plugins for free. The mobile clients cost money ($10 per platform, once) which I think makes perfect sense.

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#134

Post by snuxoll » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:48 PM UTC

crankylinuxuser wrote: post #127

bpicolo wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably nothing other than ease of use, but the old model isn't part of the equation for me. 5 bucks a month for my whole family to have good password security practices, and for 1password to sustain continuous updates, is a great deal.

Something as critical as "password infrastructure" should absolutely never be a subscription model. Pay software, sure. But by no means should anybody other than you have the ability to refuse access, especially some company where you are nothing but a $5/month number. I would be more forgiving if the subscription was for value-added features, like dynamic syncing, or remote encrypted storage. But it ain't.

> or remote encrypted storage

That’s a key component of a 1Password subscription, they host your vaults and handle annoying details like access control, etc.

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#135

Post by dingo_bat » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:48 PM UTC

Casseres wrote: post #90

dingo_bat wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you want perpetual free updates? I think your expectations might be a tad unrealistic.

It should be built into the initial price. And perpetual is unrealistic, but 10 years is not. Microsoft provides 5 years of Mainstream Support and 5 years of Extended Support at no additional cost (cost is built into the initial license fee). Heck, I would more trust software that says 10 years of garunteed support rather than lifetime support. Too many companies fudge the meaning of "lifetime", and 10 years blows Go…

> It should be built into the initial price. And perpetual is unrealistic, but 10 years is not.

That mechanism is not built into the apple app store, which is why they cannot offer it.

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#136

Post by dingo_bat » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:49 PM UTC

PakG1 wrote: post #72

dingo_bat wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This article is not about subscription only apps. 1password is available both as a standalone app and a subscription based one. But on the Apple app store they decided to offer only the subscription variant because of apples restrictions.

Right, I believe that jives with my point about how this philosophy of app deployment doesn't make for a good long-term business. I guess their line of thinking is the same as mine, but they come to a different conclusion because they have long-term concerns to think about.

I think this illustrates that apple's app store only serves apple's interests in the long term. If I happen to buy and use any Apple product, I'll go out of my way to avoid apple's supported methods to pay for my software.

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#137

Post by pvg » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:51 PM UTC

durkie wrote: post #105

pvg wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this supposed to be a rebuttal to something or do you actually need help finding it?

I'm interested in where it is. I have recommended 1Password to friends saying that I had heard standalone version was still available, but I am unable to find it on their site.

https://blog.agilebits.com/2018/03/28/the-1password-7-beta-f...

There's also a Windows version now.

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#138

Post by Mister_Snuggles » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:52 PM UTC

curun1r wrote: post #120

0culus wrote: post #82

Although it's been said that they will continue supporting licenses through their website, they have made this feature _extremely_ difficult to find ever since introducing subscriptions. I've been a loyal user of 1Password for a long time, and I think it's great software. I use it on both my Macs, as well as on my iOS devices. However, hiding the non-subscription feature is silly. I do not wish to add yet another sub…

I feel the same way and I'm starting to look towards alternatives. Despite having bought (or had bought for me, at various jobs) somewhere between 10 and 15 individual licenses, 1Password won't ever get another dime from me after the way they've treated non-subscription customers. In addition to making it confusing to use my license, the command-line doesn't work at all without a subscription and now other software t…

> I feel the same way and I'm starting to look towards alternatives.

Enpass[0] is worth a look. Free on desktop, one-time fee on Mobile, sync via the cloud provider of your choice. Also available for Linux, which is what drew me to it.

[0] https://www.enpass.io/

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#139

Post by dwg » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:54 PM UTC

tgb wrote: post #109

Can I use this space to ask how people actually use password managers on mobile? I got LastPass recently and put on it a good secure "correct horse battery staple"-type password. So now when I use accounts on my phone I have to type that password instead of my short, randomly generated, reused-all-the-time password. This means I'm more secure (no password reuse) but typing 30ish characters without error into my phone…

Aside from using biometrics, which makes it much easier, you might consider using a long passphrase as the master password. A passphrase is easier to remember and to type than random characters. It’s what I do, and it’s pretty easy to type without mistakes on mobile too.

Re: Getting 1Password 7 ready for the Mac App Store

#140

Post by ken » Sun, May 20, 2018, 4:54 PM UTC

Casseres wrote: post #90

dingo_bat wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you want perpetual free updates? I think your expectations might be a tad unrealistic.

It should be built into the initial price. And perpetual is unrealistic, but 10 years is not. Microsoft provides 5 years of Mainstream Support and 5 years of Extended Support at no additional cost (cost is built into the initial license fee). Heck, I would more trust software that says 10 years of garunteed support rather than lifetime support. Too many companies fudge the meaning of "lifetime", and 10 years blows Go…

10 years is a long time. Over its lifetime, Apple has changed the Mac's CPU architecture every 10 years. (They've been on Intel for 11 years now, the longest of any, but there's been rumors of another migration for a couple years now.) Needing to support Mac software for 10 years, then, means supporting your users through an architecture change.

There's probably not much platform-specific code in a password manager, but what are the odds it'll work perfectly under their next emulator, or that you can take such an old codebase and just recompile? 10 years ago, the old "pbproj" format was still supported, but the last Xcode that could open them was Xcode 3 (requires OS X 10.5 or 10.6).

Less than 10 years passed between the last Apple IIe sold by Apple and the first PowerMac G5. Or the last Newton to the first iPhone. Or the original Apple I to the Macintosh II. That timescale has big generational changes, and I don't agree that it's realistic for third-party developers to support software that long at no extra cost.