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College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

nytimes.com

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Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#311

Post by [deleted] »

mkirklions wrote: post #296
whataretensors wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nah, it had nothing to do with your personal racism toward your friends for being Mexican. Dude I'm Mexican. I showed you stats on high dropout rates of other hispanics and you call me racist, meanwhile claiming all of those dropouts are lazy. >If you didnt pass math and engineering, you didnt care enough[...] Lets be honest here, if you put those kinda hours into engineering school, you can expect to get As and Bs…

Confirming laziness. Instead of taking responsibility for not studying enough, you blame it on race. Your friends shouldve studied harder. It sounds like you knew what needed to be done.

[deleted]

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#312

Post by vkou »

derefr wrote: post #275
eanzenberg wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I fully agree with the US decision. I want my MDs to pass some baseline aptitude set by US regulation and if a governing board decides a country cannot meet that then those doctors need to re-apply.

They don’t just need to re-do the testing; they need to waste six years and another $300k of tuition to learn things they already know, before anyone will be willing to test them.

That's because residency programs are completely messed up.

But this is just one of the many reasons for why medical care is so expensive in the US.

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#313

Post by Eire_Banshee »

deadmetheny wrote: post #308
Eire_Banshee wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I paid out of pocket. Just had to do the national guard for 6 years. They paid for like, 90% of it. It was pretty dope.

Very nice, I forgot about the military covering school as well. Thank you for your service.

Yeah, there are some stipulations. Like, you have to go to an in state school. You do give up a significant chunk of your weekends and summers. I was a year behind all of my peers due to training.

But to have almost zero debt is worth it. More people should consider it.

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#314

Post by [deleted] »

anchpop wrote: post #306
whataretensors wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Failed out of engineering= they didnt care I don't even know how to respond to this... my friends didn't fail out from a lack of effort. You also don't know this but all of my old friends are Mexican - so you are implicitly saying the reason they didn't succeed is because they are lazy Mexicans. I don't think you intended to take this stance. You likely got tricked with everyone else into believing in social constr…

> I don't even know how to respond to this... my friends didn't fail out from a lack of effort. You also don't know this but all of my old friends are Mexican - so you are implicitly saying the reason they didn't succeed is because they are lazy Mexicans. I don't think you intended to take this stance. This is exactly the stance the GP intended to take. He said if you failed out of engineering, you're lazy. If you're…

[deleted]

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#315

Post by VikingCoder »

oh_sigh wrote: post #290
VikingCoder wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With the median wage being 20s or 30s, what's the median debt? Do you know how much student loan debt vets have? https://www.studentloanplanner.com/veterinarian/ Also, I have several veterinarian friends, and about half of them are absolutely struggling financially. Do you have personal contact with some, just out of curiosity? And if you're curious, the suicide rate for vets is very high. We could argue the reasons,…

Yes, my sister is a vet outside of Raleigh. Taking out a $400k loan for education seems like a bad idea unless you know you will be making 150-200+. My sister graudated with something like $150k debt, and it is fully repaid now(8 years after graduation) The mistake the lady in the article made is she picked basically the most expensive option and graduated with debt that is greater than 90% of her peers. She could ha…

There are only 30 vet schools in the United States. It is in many respects harder to get into than vet school.

Tuition is very expensive. I don't know how your sister graduated with $150k in debt. She was for sure in-state. Was her undergrad paid for entirely by parents or scholarship?

According to this one, vets are higher than farmers:

https://mentalhealthdaily.com/2015/01/06/top-11-professions-...

But yeah, I don't know how that's divided among the different kinds of vets.

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#316

Post by whataretensors »

mkirklions wrote: post #296
whataretensors wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nah, it had nothing to do with your personal racism toward your friends for being Mexican. Dude I'm Mexican. I showed you stats on high dropout rates of other hispanics and you call me racist, meanwhile claiming all of those dropouts are lazy. >If you didnt pass math and engineering, you didnt care enough[...] Lets be honest here, if you put those kinda hours into engineering school, you can expect to get As and Bs…

Confirming laziness. Instead of taking responsibility for not studying enough, you blame it on race. Your friends shouldve studied harder. It sounds like you knew what needed to be done.

With all due respect, you are indoctrinated into a culture of lies meant to confuse you into thinking you aren't special, likely to prevent you from negotiating or escaping.

We can't expect everyone to be athletes or bodybuilders. Not everything is a test of will.

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#317

Post by VikingCoder »

oh_sigh wrote: post #292
BlackDeath3 wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Vets can easily make 100k+ in rural areas where the median wage is in the 20s or 30s... Eh... depends on the job. I don't think that most prospective veterinarians dream of working for the USDA ($$$) when they graduate.

The median vet pay is $89k[1]. You don't need to work for the USDA to make 6 figures. [1] https://money.usnews.com/careers/best-jobs/veterinarian/sala...

If median vet pay is $89k, then by definition much less than half of vets are making 100k.

So, how is it "easy" to make 100k+?

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#318

Post by VikingCoder »

s73v3r_ wrote: post #270
VikingCoder wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair enough. And I'm just talking out of my ass about my own theories, here. I still welcome conversation to try to inform myself. Roughly, I think we should think in terms of Trade Schools and Liberal Arts programs. I'm a huge fan of Liberal Arts programs, but I don't think they should be a pre-requisite for a STEM career. They also shouldn't be a pre-requisite for many jobs that people have today. We should all be…

I think Liberal Arts programs absolutely should be a prereq for STEM careers. One of the reasons tech is in the state it is, is due to the lack of ethics courses taught.

Sure, make it a huge contributing factor in promotion, moving to project management, etc.

But not a pre-req for day one, earning a salary.

Hell, let's make some Continuing Education demands on STEM.

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#319

Post by VikingCoder »

RandallBrown wrote: post #294
VikingCoder wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the student loan default rate is high, they are accepting too many. That's a metric that would work today. A metric that might work in the future is to look at employment and job satisfaction. > You just need to trust people to act vaguely in their own interest, and society's interest, most of the time and to trust that things will work out. Sure. And I want free college, and progressive taxation. I also advise th…

Schools don't necessarily know your major until your junior or senior year. Are you proposing a system where a school would accept you, decide there were too many of your preferred major, and kick you out or choose another? The other option would be to force 17/18 year olds to choose their future careers while in high school.

> a school would accept you, decide there were too many of your preferred major, and kick you out or choose another

That happens all the time.

So, yes.

Re: College May Not Be Worth It Anymore

#320

Post by VikingCoder »

justin66 wrote: post #288
VikingCoder wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the student loan default rate is high, they are accepting too many. That's a metric that would work today. A metric that might work in the future is to look at employment and job satisfaction. > You just need to trust people to act vaguely in their own interest, and society's interest, most of the time and to trust that things will work out. Sure. And I want free college, and progressive taxation. I also advise th…

> If the student loan default rate is high, they are accepting too many. It's fun to think about how screwed up a society would become if it did simpleminded, authoritarian things like reduce the number of seats for education students because teachers defaulted on their student loans at a higher rate than business students, and opened up a corresponding number of spots for business students. There are so many factors…

> So much of what you're talking about already exists.

That's why I said "do a far better job of ... thinking about"

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