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List of screw drives

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Re: List of screw drives

#51

Post by northwest66 »

hondaguy wrote: post #49
joshu wrote: post #7

Do you find yourself stripping Phillips head acres frequently? That is because you are confusing Phillips and Pozidriv heads. They look similar but have a different head and different amount of engagement. I just bought myself some Wiha drivers after years of using shitty tools. I am so much happier now.

Reminds me of the slight difference between Phillips head and JIS (Japanese Industrial Standard) drivers.

Yes, very important when working on decades old Japanese motorcycles. Hozan make some nice sets if anybody is looking.

Re: List of screw drives

#52

Post by TeMPOraL »

analog31 wrote: post #12

I suspect that aside from tamper proof designs, most screw head development is driven from the manufacturing or assembly side. After all, most screws will never be unscrewed.

> After all, most screws will never be unscrewed.

That's because they don't want you to unscrew them. There's a bit of a feedback loop here - the less user-serviceable stuff you make, the less users expect to be able to fix things themselves, so there's less need to make next things user-serviceable.

Re: List of screw drives

#53

Post by TeMPOraL »

anamexis wrote: post #43
nlawalker wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just learned about Nominal Pipe Size, in which the number that precedes the word "inches" does not refer to any actual measurement on the pipe. The specific characteristic of the gas grill pipe hookup on the back of my house that makes it a "half inch pipe" is that it has a .84 inch outer diameter; there is literally nothing about it, including the inner diameter, that could be described by the words "half inch". h…

Then of course there's North American dimensional lumber, where the actual dimensions are either 1/4, 1/2, or 3/4 inches less than the nominal dimensions. A 2x4 is 1.5 x 3.5 inches.

Basically people using numbers as symbols. Quite annoying.

Re: List of screw drives

#54

Post by rypskar »

kazinator wrote: post #23
analog31 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work for a company that makes scientific equipment. We apply a few basic criteria, which narrow things down a lot. First, a lot of those fasteners are either really specialized or just rare or obsolete. So they can be ruled out. We look for something that will be easy for our assemblers, and for our field service technicians. They have given us feedback on what they like and dislike, including what kinds of tools a…

> We even have mixtures of US and metric in some products! In North America, tire sizes are given in millimeter width, but imperial mounting diameter. E.g. 175-65R14: 175mm width, 65% aspect ratio (sidewall height to width or something like that), for a 14" wheel.

That's not even a North America only thing, as far as I know the format mm-%R/D" (175-65R14) is used universal. Of course only vintage cars have diagonal tires now so you will probably not see a tire with D

Re: List of screw drives

#55

Post by grzm »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #53
anamexis wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then of course there's North American dimensional lumber, where the actual dimensions are either 1/4, 1/2, or 3/4 inches less than the nominal dimensions. A 2x4 is 1.5 x 3.5 inches.

Basically people using numbers as symbols. Quite annoying.

The history is a little more interesting than that:

> Lumber's nominal dimensions are larger than the actual standard dimensions of finished lumber. Historically, the nominal dimensions were the size of the green (not dried), rough (unfinished) boards that eventually became smaller finished lumber through drying and planing (to smooth the wood). Today, the standards specify the final finished dimensions and the mill cuts the logs to whatever size it needs to achieve those final dimensions. Typically, that rough cut is smaller than the nominal dimensions because modern technology makes it possible and it uses the logs more efficiently. For example, a "2×4" board historically started out as a green, rough board actually 2 by 4 inches (51 mm × 102 mm). After drying and planing, it would be smaller, by a nonstandard amount. Today, a "2×4" board starts out as something smaller than 2 inches by 4 inches and not specified by standards, and after drying and planing is reliably 1½ by 3½ inches (38 mm × 89 mm).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumber#North_American_softwood...

Re: List of screw drives

#56

Post by kazinator »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #53
anamexis wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then of course there's North American dimensional lumber, where the actual dimensions are either 1/4, 1/2, or 3/4 inches less than the nominal dimensions. A 2x4 is 1.5 x 3.5 inches.

Basically people using numbers as symbols. Quite annoying.

Like a 4.5" so-called six inch sandwich at Subway.

Re: List of screw drives

#57

Post by agumonkey »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #52
analog31 wrote: post #12

I suspect that aside from tamper proof designs, most screw head development is driven from the manufacturing or assembly side. After all, most screws will never be unscrewed.

> After all, most screws will never be unscrewed. That's because they don't want you to unscrew them. There's a bit of a feedback loop here - the less user-serviceable stuff you make, the less users expect to be able to fix things themselves, so there's less need to make next things user-serviceable.

Totally. I'm a bit shocked how effective this is. For years the sight of a torx or rarer socket would stop me from even thinking about opening a device. I don't know if it was impossible to find before but today you can buy most heads easily. And when you think about it, it's just a damn contact surface for a lever.. don't stop (unless there's a real safety hazard)

Re: List of screw drives

#59

Post by k_sze »

joshu wrote: post #7

Do you find yourself stripping Phillips head acres frequently? That is because you are confusing Phillips and Pozidriv heads. They look similar but have a different head and different amount of engagement. I just bought myself some Wiha drivers after years of using shitty tools. I am so much happier now.

IMHO, the Phillips head is pure evil and persists mostly because it’s one of the best ways to cause consumer-induced early obsolescence in any product that requires assembly by the end-consumer. It’s a huge unspoken conspiracy in the manufacturing world: “You supply Phillips screws. I supply Phillips screws. Everybody supplies Phillips screws. Everybody stays happy (except the consumers).”

“You stripped the screw head because you didn’t apply enough pressure.” O’RLY?

I wish governments would gradually outlaw Phillips. And I predict that the EU will be the pioneers in doing this.

I’m half kidding and half ranting.

Re: List of screw drives

#60

Post by TeMPOraL »

agumonkey wrote: post #57
TeMPOraL wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> After all, most screws will never be unscrewed. That's because they don't want you to unscrew them. There's a bit of a feedback loop here - the less user-serviceable stuff you make, the less users expect to be able to fix things themselves, so there's less need to make next things user-serviceable.

Totally. I'm a bit shocked how effective this is. For years the sight of a torx or rarer socket would stop me from even thinking about opening a device. I don't know if it was impossible to find before but today you can buy most heads easily. And when you think about it, it's just a damn contact surface for a lever.. don't stop (unless there's a real safety hazard)

Same here. The first couple of years I encountered torx sockets, I called them "those ones they put to prevent you from repairing things". The drivers weren't impossible to find, but they also weren't commonplace.

It was doubly annoying when I had devices that had regular cruciform sockets (that I could even handle with a knife if in a hurry) on the outside, but then suddenly torx sockets inside.

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