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Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

theglobeandmail.com

231–240 of 715 posts

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#231
So all you people making $100K+ salary, how much are you actually saving per month?

I make half that, live in Vancouver, own a car, and still invest $1,000 a month. I already have more money saved than 99% of Canadians and I'm only 27.

I imagine you Americans with six figure salaries are saving 3-5K per month? Crazy.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kinda unrelated to immigration, but I've heard Canadian border patrol is actually more harsh than American border control. Anyone with experience that can verify?

Back when you only needed a drivers license to cross the border, the Canadian border person looked at my Texas driver's license and said, "Texas, huh. Where are your guns?" That would be considered unacceptable and unprofessional at U.S. border control.

Hah, I had exactly the same experience crossing into Ontario in either 2003 or 2006.

We had six people and a ton of luggage and they seemed to be seriously considering searching all our bags just because of Texas IDs. :|

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#233
post #188
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> who are hesitant to move to USA because of immigration restrictions. Where does this perception come from? Canada has stricter immigration rules than the USA. EDIT: Specifically what I'm talking about is that Canada only allows in immigrants who are economically desirable and speak English or French.

I am an European that has immigrated to both countries at different points, and my experience couldn't be farther from what you describe. And my stint in the USA was 20 years ago, which was the wild west compared to today. What do you mean by stricter here?

If it was easy for you it's because you're economically desirable and culturally compatible. Canada only accepts immigrants who have a high probability of financial success and "integration", along with a limited number of refugees who have sponsors.

The USA on the other hand has a relatively open employer-backed system in addition to the wealth/education-agnostic quota system.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#234
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been weighing making a move from Saskatchewan to New Brunswick. When I compare Regina to Fredericton (as an example) though, it seems like I must be missing something. On the surface, pay is generally better, the stacks/companies are more interesting, the location seems amazing, and comparable real estate is less than half. I know that Regina->NB is dramatically different from Toronto->NB, but is there anythin…

Might be obvious, but the biggest thing you'll give up in this market compared to cities like Toronto or Montréal is selection. There's some larger companies with satellite offices here (IBM, Salesforce, etc), but not too many startups. One word of caution about real estate in the Fredericton area; don't buy any property too close to the river. There's usually flooding in the spring from the snow melt up stream and t…

First, I apologize. I know that the river is flooding right now and I asked you 'should I move' questions when you could have been facing a tragedy. That was very selfish of me and I'm sorry.

I'm very glad you weren't affected by the flooding, and thanks for being kind, despite my gaffe!

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#235
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm wondering how that salary difference really is when comparing the cost of living of many Canadian cities vs Silicon Valley, the taxation rate and the social services provided (universal healthcare, etc).

The cost of living between Vancouver and Seattle is very comparable, especially when you account for your biggest input costs, housing, food & transportation. The Salaries most definitely are not. The biggies south of the border set the baseline salary for everyone; when they move north they match the existing, much lower rates. If I was a new-ish grad and wanted to stay in the PNW there's not a chance I'd pick Vanco…

Eating out is definitely better in Vancouver than Seattle, both in variety and price. However, that’s about it.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#236
post #166

Canadian tech worker here. Base salary is 120k CAD in Calgary which is far above market rate but I am educated, experienced etc. That is 93k USD. I am looking to move to the USA because of higher salaries, but I am not 22 years old anymore and moving a family (with 2 earners) is no easy task. It falls on deaf ears though, 120k CAD is a good income, I can afford a house, cars, no debts etc so there is very little unde…

In Silicon Valley, most likely you are not going to afford a house anyway.. .

Sunnyvale (current ground zero of Apple) median is close to 2M - that is only 5x of $400K which a lot of FANG and other engineers pull yearly (and that is the main reason for current SV home prices as, during such low mortgage rates, the market is naturally self-adjusting to 5-6x of prevalent salaries. In 2008 those houses were $700-800K+ - the 5-6x of those $120K-150K salaries back then).

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#237
post #160
post #66

Canada is in a really tough spot here. I've always admired Canadian culture/values, and in the abstract, would love to live in Canada one day. However, as a Software developer, the compensation and opportunities that one can find in SF/Seattle/NYC dwarf anything in Canada. Until this changes, Canada is always going to lose its brightest engineers, which will in turn worsen the problem even further. Some solutions I c…

> who are hesitant to move to USA because of immigration restrictions. Where does this perception come from? Canada has stricter immigration rules than the USA. EDIT: Specifically what I'm talking about is that Canada only allows in immigrants who are economically desirable and speak English or French.

Given the current H1B lottery, even someone with excellent credentials will most likely be denied the visa, purely due to random chance.

Also, even if you get the H1B and apply for Permanent Residency, the wait time can be obscenely long depending on where you were born. If you were born in China, you'll have to wait for 6+ years. If you were born in India, you'll have to wait for 12+ years.

Ironically enough, if you're a not-very-qualified applicant, you'll likely have a easier time applying here in USA. The Canadian system might be more stringent, but rolls out the red carpet for those who are truly qualified, and in greater numbers too. The American system is the exact opposite.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#238
post #166

Canadian tech worker here. Base salary is 120k CAD in Calgary which is far above market rate but I am educated, experienced etc. That is 93k USD. I am looking to move to the USA because of higher salaries, but I am not 22 years old anymore and moving a family (with 2 earners) is no easy task. It falls on deaf ears though, 120k CAD is a good income, I can afford a house, cars, no debts etc so there is very little unde…

I left Toronto Canada 25 years ago. Earned more in the first 10 years than I could have earned in my entire life in Toronto, Canada. The USA is the Land of Milk and Honey.

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#239
post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Silicon Valley, most likely you are not going to afford a house anyway.. .

Sunnyvale (current ground zero of Apple) median is close to 2M - that is only 5x of $400K which a lot of FANG and other engineers pull yearly (and that is the main reason for current SV home prices as, during such low mortgage rates, the market is naturally self-adjusting to 5-6x of prevalent salaries. In 2008 those houses were $700-800K+ - the 5-6x of those $120K-150K salaries back then).

If only there were some way to put more houses on a given plot of land, perhaps by stacking one on top of another, we could somehow break this dynamic. http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2013/04/11/san_francisco...

Re: Canada facing ‘brain drain’ as tech talent leaves for Silicon Valley

#240
post #197
post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a weird comparison, I guess you say that because California's population (39 million) is close to that of Canada's (36.3 million)? No doubt California is diverse, and by no means homogenous, but Canada... is physically huge, and relatively speaking, very sparsely populated. This naturally leads to more diversity within an already "small" population. To develop a business with a target market of "all of Califor…

Not really. The vast majority of those 35 million live in 3 really small areas. Just like the vast majority of california lives on the coast. California is a physically huge state by the way, that is fairly sparsely populated in big swaths of the state.

Unlike Canada, California benefits from a pool of ~290 million other people who self-select to move there with 0 barriers other than having a few dollars to buy a gray hound ticket.
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