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Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

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Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#61

Post by atulatul »

Interesting article. Not written in the same way but an interesting earlier HN post on similar topic: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8877737

-- I think Indians(maybe Asians) get this detachment philosophy as a cultural gift. Practicing it is of course a different matter. But it is easier for me to understand (or at least not have too many doubts about) the Samkara/Sanskara/Karma thing. For example, when the linked article (100 Hours of Meditation in 10 Days — My Stay in Buddhist Prison) talks about the saliva-swallowing or a lady sobbing, it does not raise too many questions in my mind. Although Naipaul has written about its ill-effects (India A Wounded Civilization))

The term(detachment philosophy) is used loosely.

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#62

Post by peab »

MichaelGG wrote: post #33
sgentle wrote: post #16

This paper is a pretty comprehensive take on Vipassana, so in case anyone's looking for something a bit more general, I'd like to offer a complementary summary based on my own experiences. Vipassana is a 10-day silent meditation retreat. Silent in this case really means distraction-free, entertainment-free, or stimulation-free. Think of it as the diametric opposite of social news. No noise, no conversation, no instan…

Excellent review, thank you. You capture the vividness of it very well. I will add a disclaimer, if you are talking about Goekna / Dhamma.org retreats. They are absolutely not just about technique or dogma-free, despite their marketing. They are overtly religious and the entire retreat is couched in hand-wavy woo. The retreat itself was amazing. I went to one in Quebec. Excellent facilities, crystal clear skies (it w…

I also went to the one in Quebec!

I couldn't agree more. At one point they try to assert that the technique is completely scientific, and has been proven by some physicist.

I took it all seriously because I wanted to see how deep I could go. The effects were pretty far out, but I can't say that they were beneficial.

10 days of camping will be far more beneficial.

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#63

Post by 0xcde4c3db »

0xFFC wrote: post #3

I am always curious about how much meditation can affect our brains. In pop science and pop culture, we see a lot of overestimation about meditation affects on our brains. But what is the scientific perspective on meditation?

As far as I know there isn't even a scientific consensus on a definition of meditation, let alone what its exact effects are. There are thousands of studies, but high-quality ones seem to be rare. I also get the impression that the literature is heavily biased toward a handful of relatively recent traditions or techniques (e.g. many, many studies are specifically on Transcendental Meditation or Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction).

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#64

Post by chiefgeek »

collyw wrote: post #53
thsowers wrote: post #29

> The only way one can learn the technique of Vipassana is to take a 10-day course Is this really true? I agree that a large amount of people may not be able to learn the techniques outside of a retreat setting, but I think it comes down to the individual and is different for each person

I have been meditating for maybe 6 months now but just for between 10 and 45 minutes a day (and not consistently). I I haven't come close to the level of depth described in the article. I guess its possible but the intensity of such a course must help.

I, too, meditated for 10-30 minutes a day for about a year before attending a Vipassana retreat and had the same experience. Even upon returning from the retreat and meditating 30 minutes in the morning and 30 in the evening, I was not able to replicate the experience of the course. I returned and served for three days last fall, during which time I meditated for 3-4 hours a day and began to approach the feelings once or twice.

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#65

Post by AlexCoventry »

milkmiruku wrote: post #59
AlexCoventry wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For people interested in what meditation really "is," at least from a Buddhist perspective, Ven. Thanissaro is worth a look. Among his many excellent books is Right Mindfulness: Memory & Ardency on the Buddhist Path > For the past several decades, a growing flood of books, articles, and teachings has advanced theories about the practice of mindfulness which are highly questionable and—for anyone hoping to realize the…

Ṭhānissaro Bhikkhu++ Also, Sujato Bhikkhu; http://santifm.org/santipada/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/A_Hi... - "A History of Mindfulness", large pdf http://dharmafarer.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/... - "Satipaṭṭhāna Mūla: A reconstruction of the 'original' pre-sectarian Satipaṭṭhāna Sutta", small pdf

I love what he's tried to do with A History of Mindfulness. Incredibly ambitious and creative!

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#66

Post by fsloth »

sorokod wrote: post #56
fsloth wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The original question, to which I answered, was, that what does non-religious spirituality mean? I described what a spiritual experience felt like to me. So, I suppose the key here is the personal experience. I'm sure there are a lot of ways people can have deep spiritual experiences without them interpreting it as communicating with divine forces.

I didn't mean to try to belittle you experience in any way. The one thing I am tying to validate / invalidate is weather "spiritual" as used by non religious people, is mere hacking of our delicate physical and chemical machinery.

Uh, no, I didn't understand it as belitteling. I think you raised a fair point in the context of this discussion. I don't think we have very good syntax yet to discuss these things.

I don't know, but I have a gut feeling the spiritual awe one gets from one religious sacrament or another and getting it through other means are the same thing.

Effectively, the way I see it, religions claim something that is universal and publicly available as under their domain. It's like a guy came and wanted to resell the air you breath back at you.

Similarly I feel drug afficionados are sometimes overselling their hobby as the one key to the mysteries of the universe.

I don't mind if someone is religious or likes to do drugs. What I don't like, is that one or another claims something that can gained by other means as belonging to their dominion.

The major religions are especially intransigent and arrogant about this in their creed - claiming things that belong to all men and women to belong only to one sect or another - thus poisoning themselves doubly by first trying to fool those outside of their creed, and then being intellectually dishonest of their own experiences.

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#67

Post by weavie »

thsowers wrote: post #29

> The only way one can learn the technique of Vipassana is to take a 10-day course Is this really true? I agree that a large amount of people may not be able to learn the techniques outside of a retreat setting, but I think it comes down to the individual and is different for each person

It depends what you really mean by 'learn'. I have heard it said that there are certain levels of insight that you can gain only after meditating constantly for a long period of time such as 10 days.

You can however certainly learn how to get started, and reap benefits, from Vipassana in just 20 minutes a day.

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#68

Post by akvadrako »

skosch wrote: post #25
nabla9 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has practiced over 19 years very intensively, my opinion is that pop science and culture overplays the effects of moderate meditation (say 30 min per day) in a short term and mostly misunderstand the effects of long term meditation. The starting assumption of a secular meditator (like me) usually is that we want to develop some abilities. You are you, just better. If you meditate a lot, or very long ti…

> Eventually you are going towards direction where you don't want to go ... this is the end of the road for many people. It sounds like you're saying that moderate meditation is overrated, and more intense meditation is outright detrimental in the long term. That is surprising to me. Is this an inevitability? Did you experience this, and how did you push through it?

What he's describing doesn't sound detrimental to me; it sounds like facing the truth, which might be a very dark place, but it's what we'll all end up facing eventually.

And of course, there is probably something behind that too, of which I have no idea.

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#69

Post by akvadrako »

tome wrote: post #4
0xFFC wrote: post #3

I am always curious about how much meditation can affect our brains. In pop science and pop culture, we see a lot of overestimation about meditation affects on our brains. But what is the scientific perspective on meditation?

How do you know it's overestimation if you haven't seen the scientific perspective?

By doing it and experiencing it yourself.

Re: Vipassana for Hackers [pdf]

#70

Post by redmaverick »

tokyodude wrote: post #46
sgentle wrote: post #16

This paper is a pretty comprehensive take on Vipassana, so in case anyone's looking for something a bit more general, I'd like to offer a complementary summary based on my own experiences. Vipassana is a 10-day silent meditation retreat. Silent in this case really means distraction-free, entertainment-free, or stimulation-free. Think of it as the diametric opposite of social news. No noise, no conversation, no instan…

what would you consider lasting impacts of your experience?

My experience was a loss of sweet tooth permanently. Before I had a lot of craving for sweet stuff and had to fight with myself to cut the craving. After the Vipassana that craving is no longer there like before.

Apart from this one thing, there are no lasting impacts. If I meditate an hour in the morning and an hour in the evening, the effect lasts around 24 hours and I gradually revert back to my original state, so I have to maintain the meditation practice to maintain the results.

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