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Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

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Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#271

Post by kingofhdds »

OliverJones wrote: post #194
akuji1993 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still completely convinced that this whole scandal will not damage Facebook a bit, in the long term. Yeah, the stock is going to be a bit lower for some weeks, some people will leave, but the largest part of the Facebook users has not even realised the scandal in full scale. They're not going anywhere, they're going to continue as is, since there really is not alternative for Facebook right now and tbh they would…

> the largest part of the Facebook users has not even > realized the scandal in full scale. Exactly. That's why they must be regulated. Pharma companies, food companies, and airlines, to mention three, have the same sorts of characteristics in their businesses. Examples: Airlines have regulations because the typical user has no way to evaluate maintenance regimes or navigation procedures. The big information-hooverin…

No, in fact, airlines have regulations, because big flying objects loaded with fuel are kinda seriously dangerous, and can kill (not in un*x console meaning of the word) lots of people at once. Very unlike social platforms, to be fair.

If regulations were introduced because of users not knowing what's good and beautiful, believe me, IT industry would be the most regulated thing in the world.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#272

Post by sametmax »

xstartup wrote: post #143
sametmax wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is not that they took it. There are always bad actors. The problem is that very few people cared. So even if people start leaving facebook in mass, it will just start all over again with another bad actor.

Or you can say, they did not care because bad actors paid them?

Again, leaders are not the main issue. The problem is more that very little users cared.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#273

Post by pbhjpbhj »

torstenvl wrote: post #145
awalton wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Legally yes, they had permission. California is a two-party consent state for recording, and it's not an unreasonable stretch to say this should also include call metadata. If one party (i.e. Me) opted out, and someone else didn't, they now have a log that I didn't give them permission to make. I think this is probably the most strong case users will have against Facebook, and I honestly think it's a pretty damned…

it's not an unreasonable stretch to say this should also include call metadata Yes. It is an unreasonable stretch. Cal. Penal Code § 632 prohibits "eavesdrop[ping] upon or record[ing] [a] confidential communication." There is no set of circumstances in the history of telecommunications where seeing your itemized phone bill is the same as eavesdropping. I understand you feel violated. You should. What Facebook did is…

Recording that a confidential communication happened appears to read on to that law, that's still part of "recording a communication".

If a law said i couldn't "record your visit to a shop" and I shared commercially that you "went to the shop at X time and stayed Y minutes" even if I didn't record the details of your purchases, or what you were wearing, or whatever, it would still appear to be a contravention of the letter of that law.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#274

Post by sametmax »

kenning wrote: post #109
sametmax wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is not that they took it. There are always bad actors. The problem is that very few people cared. So even if people start leaving facebook in mass, it will just start all over again with another bad actor.

> So even if people start leaving facebook in mass, it will just start all over again with another bad actor. unless they want to prevent this from happening in the long run?

Who are "they" in your sentence ? If "they" are Facebook, then it's not the point. If "they" are the user, then I doubt that the current outrage is anything more than the scandal "du jour". I spent 10 years talking about this with people around me. Very little cared enough to even start thinking about it for a minute. Not to mention taking life decision with it in mind.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#275

Post by intrasight »

FB can't collect call and SMS data from my browser ;)

It was so patently obvious that they would do this with any app that I am surprised there's a stink being made about it now.

I don't understand why people fall prey to the "install our privacy invading app" when the service works just fine via a browser.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#276

Post by notwhereyouare »

Gaelan wrote: post #5

The Facebook blog post includes this screenshot [0]. That's definitely an opt-in, although I could imagine a non-technical person clicking through it without reading the grey text. Better than nothing. [0]: https://fbnewsroomus.files.wordpress.com/2018/03/opt-in_scre...

that is actually a different screen then when they first rolled it out. You had to dig into another screen to opt out.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#277

Post by pbhjpbhj »

slivym wrote: post #198
anilakar wrote: post #83

I suspected this many years ago when familiar faces from our customers started to appear in the friend suggestion box. I've never installed the FB app on my phone, but our less privacy oriented customers probably have. What pisses me off is that while I can choose what information I share, I haven't given other people nor Facebook permission to read phone call logs that involve me.

Do you think you have the right to share with people your call logs without the permission of the people you were calling? I would say you do. So I don't see how you can reasonably object to someone sharing with Facebook the fact that they called you in their call log.

It matters, to me, if its for commercial gain and if it's done with respect for PII.

So "I called $phoneNumber" is OK but "I'll sell you details of $person's phone calls" is not.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#279

Post by superkuh »

It's weird that people can get so upset about these limited excesses of surveillance by companies they've given explicit conset to when more and more of the governments of the world are literally recording everything forever and sharing it with a rapidly expanding set of organizations made up of the same kind of people.

Re: Facebook denies it collects call and SMS data from phones without permission

#280

Post by SlowRobotAhead »

superkuh wrote: post #279

It's weird that people can get so upset about these limited excesses of surveillance by companies they've given explicit conset to when more and more of the governments of the world are literally recording everything forever and sharing it with a rapidly expanding set of organizations made up of the same kind of people.

I’ve this comment written a lot here. And while I get it and even agree partially, there is a problem of scope and precedent.

It’s easy for us to say “stupid user, wtf did you think fb was doing?” But, the truth is we don’t actually know.

As tech people we are even just guessing at the real scope of FB’s collection and how they use that data. It’s not like this is something a typical user could really know because there hasn’t been a Facebook before.

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