Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

hongkongfp.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 417 posts

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#121

Post by skrause »

emiliobumachar wrote: post #104
adamio wrote: post #64

There's claims the plastic ban bag in San Diego led to a Hepatitis outbreak https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2017/sep/08/stringers-pl...

Very informative piece. Key excerpts: "Homeless people learned long ago that pooping in plastic-bag-lined containers meant you could wrap the session up and dispose of all the stuff without touching it, he said in a long email. So when it got harder to get the bags after the ban went into effect late last year, it became harder to find the bags and people who were able to keep things clean had to work a lot harder."…

Well, other developed countries don't have so many homeless people, so that should be less of a problem there.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#122

Post by pishpash »

greeneggs wrote: post #97
adamio wrote: post #64

There's claims the plastic ban bag in San Diego led to a Hepatitis outbreak https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2017/sep/08/stringers-pl...

Two economists have claimed that the ban in San Francisco led to an increase in food-borne diseases. The proposed mechanism is that people don't wash their reusable bags, and dangerous bacteria gets onto them. It isn't clear to me how strong the evidence for this is. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2013/02/16/is-sa...

This is true, it's very unsanitary if you put unpackaged goods in there or get leaks.

Lots of stores also don't ask and give you a bag at whatever the locale's imposed fee is which they keep it, so there is an incentive to do this.

At the end of the day, the externality should not be captured by the store, but should be refunded back to the user with even distribution.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#123

Post by joelrunyon »

maym86 wrote: post #118
darkstar999 wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If that's true, it would still be a lot less plastic if we gave free access to the homeless population.

Or just access to toilets. It's not like they want to poop in bags.

They have that.

They choose the plastic bags because the toilets are in disarray.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#124

Post by jamesrcole »

picodguyo wrote: post #116
jamesrcole wrote: post #113

Does anyone know of a deeply-argued argument against the use of plastics like these? Don't take this question as meaning that I believe such an argument doesn't exist, or that I think they shouldn't be banned. I'm currently agnostic on the matter, because I don't feel I know enough about it. I tend to only hear shallowly-argued reasons for banning these things (which doesn't mean their conclusions are wrong).

Plastics are polluting and poisoning the oceans: https://www.ft.com/content/30b30b1e-004a-11e8-9650-9c0ad2d7c...

I can't read that article (says a subscription is required). Plastics may be polluting and poisoning the oceans, but

- what exactly is the source of those plastics? I saw someone else in this thread claim that it was from countries with poor waste management. So is banning use of those plastics in certain countries actually going to help? Is better waste management a better solution?

- evaluating any proposal means doing a cost/benefit analysis of it and the alternatives. So some plastics from some sources contribute to that pollution and poisoning. But how much better or worse are the alternatives to banning them?

See what I mean about shallow vs deep arguments for proposed solutions?

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#125

Post by maym86 »

adamio wrote: post #64

There's claims the plastic ban bag in San Diego led to a Hepatitis outbreak https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2017/sep/08/stringers-pl...

This is a separate problem caused by not providing homeless people access to toilets. Seems obvious that the solution is more public restrooms not more plastic bags.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#126

Post by Sargos »

privacypoller wrote: post #78
untog wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would people use this tax credit that is printed on the receipt for every supermarket trip they take? It doesn't sound even remotely practical.

What about if stores credit customers n cents per bag they don't use (i.e. for each reusable bag they do use) and then claim an annual tax credit, kind of like a mirror version of how pass-through consumption taxes like GST/VAT work?

How about putting the tax up front while the customer is on the register? It reduces the burden of documentation for both the customer and government while also ensuring near 100% compliance. Might be a good idea to look into.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#127

Post by maym86 »

joelrunyon wrote: post #123
maym86 wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or just access to toilets. It's not like they want to poop in bags.

They have that. They choose the plastic bags because the toilets are in disarray.

Or just access to well maintained public toilets.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#128

Post by noer »

AlwaysRock wrote: post #28
technofiend wrote: post #10

The UK dropped to 500 million bags annually used from 7 billion after introduction of a 5 pence per bag charge. That's just one country albeit one of the world's largest. Still I think we're over due for much more agressive action. https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2016/jul/30/england-...

Chicago started charging 7 cent a bag and that certainly made me think twice about my bag use.

I can't believe they didn't do this first instead of doing that ridiculous "No disposable plastic bag" rule. The grocery store by my house (marianos) just gave everyone paper, but it seems like most other places just switched to thicker plastic bags, called them "reusable" and gave out just as many as before.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#129

Post by antognini »

makecheck wrote: post #115

Drinks taste better without straws anyway, and you can be satisfied with a lot less by sipping directly. I was amazed how easily I could gulp down some 32 oz. drink with a straw but when opening the lid and sipping I could be perfectly happy with a tiny coffee-cup size.

I don't like straws myself, but they are better for your teeth since most beverages are acidic and the straw allows the liquid to bypass your teeth.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#130

Post by ahartmetz »

bluGill wrote: post #48
emodendroket wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've read that a dishwasher is less wasteful than hand-washing of dishes (perhaps this isn't true for people who are very, very scrupulous about their use of water while washing dishes, but that's not most of us).

Assuming you use the dishwasher correctly: you don't overload it, You don't run it too empty, and you don't pre-wash/rinse your dishes. Fail either of the above and a dishwaser uses more water. When you overload the dishwasher things don't get clean and then you wash by hand afterwards (in the case of pots/pans this might still be less water use just because when hand washing you are likely to drain the filthy water…

Arguments about water "consumption" (hint: it's still water afterwards - it tends to clean itself if you didn't outright poison it and wait a bit) do not apply in humid regions - saving water someplace else doesn't help regions with water scarcity one bit. Berlin is an extreme example, they need to pump water out of the ground in any case to prevent the area from reverting to a bog.

Hot water usually costs a lot of valuable energy though.

Post reply on HN