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Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

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Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#71

Post by barrkel »

Fifer82 wrote: post #60
toomanybeersies wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well apparently a 5p charge resulted in a 14x decrease in usage of plastic bags, so despite your anecdote, it does make a difference.

Fair enough but I wonder how much of that has to do with simply being asked? Being given a bag was standard, as normal as expecting the store to be heated. An invisible service. Now, you don't get given a bag for your Sandwich & Water at lunch, and you don't get a free bag with your McDonalds meal to name just a couple of services. 1p or 5p wouldn't make much of a difference? A Family paying 100 pound a week on shopp…

Behavioural economics teaches us that the jump from a price of zero to a price of 1 penny has a much, much larger effect than going from 1 penny to two pence.

https://market.subwiki.org/wiki/Zero_price_effect

The same acts in reverse.

I personally reuse the same bag every time I go shopping until it is damaged. When I walk to my local, I carry the two or three items I bought directly, rather than in a bag. I could afford to buy over a million plastic bags a year, yet I've changed my behaviour to avoid buying them whenever possible.

(In my case, it has nothing to do with being asked, as I invariably use the automated checkout machines. Bags are available for purchase adjacent to these machines, so it's not an availability problem either.)

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#72

Post by emodendroket »

bluGill wrote: post #48
emodendroket wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've read that a dishwasher is less wasteful than hand-washing of dishes (perhaps this isn't true for people who are very, very scrupulous about their use of water while washing dishes, but that's not most of us).

Assuming you use the dishwasher correctly: you don't overload it, You don't run it too empty, and you don't pre-wash/rinse your dishes. Fail either of the above and a dishwaser uses more water. When you overload the dishwasher things don't get clean and then you wash by hand afterwards (in the case of pots/pans this might still be less water use just because when hand washing you are likely to drain the filthy water…

I put straws in the basket with silverware. Works fine unless you've let something really dry on there (like a smoothie).

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#73

Post by [deleted] »

abakker wrote: post #50
emodendroket wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the idea of loss aversion suggests that people would be more likely to avoid taking a bag at the time than they would be to return them for a deposit (not that this is an option with bottles).

I really want a deposit/membership at my local grocery store for reusable bags. I don't want to remember them. I want to use some standard, reusable ones at the store, and then be able to return them in bulk for my deposit back. I end up taking paper bags in SF because I constantly forget to bring reusable ones, despite having dozens at home.

[deleted]

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#74

Post by fvdessen »

What is the rationale ? Are disposable plastic bags really that much worse than reusable / paper bags ? From what I understand plastic waste is usually burned for electricity or heat in industrial processes, and it's not that much worse than natural gas.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#75

Post by barrkel »

abakker wrote: post #50
emodendroket wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the idea of loss aversion suggests that people would be more likely to avoid taking a bag at the time than they would be to return them for a deposit (not that this is an option with bottles).

I really want a deposit/membership at my local grocery store for reusable bags. I don't want to remember them. I want to use some standard, reusable ones at the store, and then be able to return them in bulk for my deposit back. I end up taking paper bags in SF because I constantly forget to bring reusable ones, despite having dozens at home.

The habit to get into is have a non-bulky resuable bag that folds up nice and flat and keep it in a jacket pocket or some other location that's available when you're out and about; and to put the bag back in that place when you finish unpacking at home.

Relying on remembering before you leave the house or whatever is much less effective, I think.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#77

Post by darkstar999 »

adamio wrote: post #64

There's claims the plastic ban bag in San Diego led to a Hepatitis outbreak https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2017/sep/08/stringers-pl...

If that's true, it would still be a lot less plastic if we gave free access to the homeless population.

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#78

Post by privacypoller »

untog wrote: post #65
jimmaswell wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't like that this is a regressive tax - pay a premium for the good bags, settle for paper, or pay for reusable bags. If anything, maybe just give a tax credit for not using plastic, which is printed on the receipt.

How would people use this tax credit that is printed on the receipt for every supermarket trip they take? It doesn't sound even remotely practical.

What about if stores credit customers n cents per bag they don't use (i.e. for each reusable bag they do use) and then claim an annual tax credit, kind of like a mirror version of how pass-through consumption taxes like GST/VAT work?

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#79

Post by devy »

> “You can use steel products, or edible straws – or maybe you just don’t need to use straws at all,” he said. “There is no inconvenience caused at all.”

This is debatable. I've definitely heard dentists recommending using straws to drink sodas to reduce the acidic decay effect on front teeth (basically just prevent the teeth from exposing the to harmful liquids). [1]

[1]: https://www.webmd.com/oral-health/news/20050617/sipping-soda...

Re: Taiwan ban single-use plastic straws, plastic bags, disposable utensils by 2030

#80

Post by eigenhombre »

mattmanser wrote: post #62
toomanybeersies wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well apparently a 5p charge resulted in a 14x decrease in usage of plastic bags, so despite your anecdote, it does make a difference.

A little thing to bear in mind is that the new bags weigh significantly more than the old ones, so it's not actually a 14x decrease. With the switch all the stores now sell "lifetime" bags. According to my fairly inaccurate kitchen scales the old ones weigh about 10g, the new ones weigh about 25g. So it's about a 5.6x drop, which is still fantastic. I think everyone talks about the number of bags as it makes the decr…

The mass measurement is good to know; however, the lighter bags also take to the air and land in trees, the water, etc., a surprisingly large effect in the Windy City (yes I know it's not called that because of actual wind :-) ). This effect has almost disappeared in my neighborhood with the new tax in place.
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