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Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

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Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#111

Post by FullyFunctional »

deminature wrote: post #42
charlesdm wrote: post #8

Now, I don't live in Denmark, but am I the only one here who wouldn't like (excessive) tax policies like that? A 180% tax (now to be lowered a bit) on a vehicle seems madly excessive. It's like a ban, without actually having the guts to call it a ban. I'm assuming most normal people are unable to afford a car then. I'm not a car nut (don't even really like cars, though I do own one and don't use it often) but wouldn'…

Aside from the question of fairness, it has driven Copenhagen to have more bicycles than cars on the streets, and massive improvements to bicycle-friendliness of streets to accommodate this. It's surely an improvement from a congestion, pollution and population health/fitness standpoint. Source: https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/nov/30/cycling-revol...

dane here: this tax is infuriatingly unfair; the fact is that most politicians in Denmark live in Copenhagen where it might be practical to rely on bicycles and public transport but for the mainland this is a fantasy. There is no usuable public transport and bicyling isn't practical beyond 10 km. The people this hurt aren't living in Copenhagen.

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#112

Post by FullyFunctional »

Tehnix wrote: post #41
charlesdm wrote: post #8

Now, I don't live in Denmark, but am I the only one here who wouldn't like (excessive) tax policies like that? A 180% tax (now to be lowered a bit) on a vehicle seems madly excessive. It's like a ban, without actually having the guts to call it a ban. I'm assuming most normal people are unable to afford a car then. I'm not a car nut (don't even really like cars, though I do own one and don't use it often) but wouldn'…

>I'm assuming most normal people are unable to afford a car then They can actually. A new "normal" car would probably range between 60,000-150,000 DKK ($9,600-$24,000), but you could easily get an old used car for around 13,000-20,000 DKK ($2,000-$3,200). Now don't get me wrong, I certainly am not happy with the fact that we have to pay that much extra, but it is not a problem unless you want a really fancy car. For…

"Really well" in the big cities only. Outside the top ten, it's useless. I've lived in a handful of cities in Denmark for about 20 years and this view of public transport is a typical eastern bias.

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#113

Post by vinni2 »

tomtimtall wrote: post #35
charlesdm wrote: post #8

Now, I don't live in Denmark, but am I the only one here who wouldn't like (excessive) tax policies like that? A 180% tax (now to be lowered a bit) on a vehicle seems madly excessive. It's like a ban, without actually having the guts to call it a ban. I'm assuming most normal people are unable to afford a car then. I'm not a car nut (don't even really like cars, though I do own one and don't use it often) but wouldn'…

Dane here. Most people can adford a car if they want one. Normalt you get a loan and pay a monthly rate over the lifetime of the car. Most people who don’t need a car however would rather save the money and use public transport or bike around. I bought a car at the inflated prices, an I wouldn’t want them lowered. I do however feel that the lower fees for electric vehicles was a good thing.

From what I observed during the time I lived in Aalborg was that families with two incomes could easily afford one car and of course for families with kids a car is very much a necessity than a luxury. While recent young graduates and immigrants could not afford a car without burning a big hole in their income.

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#114

Post by FullyFunctional »

tomtimtall wrote: post #35
charlesdm wrote: post #8

Now, I don't live in Denmark, but am I the only one here who wouldn't like (excessive) tax policies like that? A 180% tax (now to be lowered a bit) on a vehicle seems madly excessive. It's like a ban, without actually having the guts to call it a ban. I'm assuming most normal people are unable to afford a car then. I'm not a car nut (don't even really like cars, though I do own one and don't use it often) but wouldn'…

Dane here. Most people can adford a car if they want one. Normalt you get a loan and pay a monthly rate over the lifetime of the car. Most people who don’t need a car however would rather save the money and use public transport or bike around. I bought a car at the inflated prices, an I wouldn’t want them lowered. I do however feel that the lower fees for electric vehicles was a good thing.

Dane here: what's the population where you live? In most of the country (by area), isn't an accurate statement that you don't need a car.

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#115

Post by FullyFunctional »

mc32 wrote: post #21
bearcobra wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really see a problem with using taxation as a mechanism to encourage behavior while still allowing a market for it. Alcohol has a lot of negative impacts for society, so making it a luxury is probably a net good. I think the arguments around cars are a little more nuanced, but if a country decides it wants to encourage public transit & walkability, that seems like a fine goal.

For one problem it's a regressive tax, unless they carve out means based exceptions that means it puts transit for some rural people out of reach.

Exactly this. And they didn't compensate, which makes this very biased and unfair.

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#116

Post by barsonme »

andys627 wrote: post #82
jonknee wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More comparison: Seattle $597 a year (just got my bill recently, vast majority pays for transit expansion)

Woah! Seattle and LA are majorly investing in transit. I'm excited to visit as they come online throughout my life!

"Seattle" is not. Three counties—Snohomish, King, and Pierce—are funding Sound Transit via insanely high car tabs (as well as additional property and sales taxes...), even though Pierce County voted against it and Snohomish only slightly for it.

If you've got a $16,000 car (KBB) you'll pay ~$425. For reference: they valued my 18 year old beater Corolla with 300k miles at approximately $1,700. KBB puts my car at $600. Granted, the MVET predates the RTA tax, but 0.3% is manageable. 1.1% is utterly insane.

And it's a 25 year project.

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#117

Post by ljf »

vinni2 wrote: post #110
zackmorris wrote: post #95

I noticed most of the comments in this thread were about not wanting a high tax rate of 100%. I just want to offer a counterexample where people are all for it: in Costa Rica there is a similar import tax on luxury and technology items and is roughly 50-80% on cars: http://www.costaricatax.com/import-tax.htm http://www.costaricatax.com/luxury-tax-cars.htm One of the main reasons for this is that everyone wants to go…

I used to live in Northern Denmark and I have experienced their healthcare first hand and witnessed social welfare which helped my friends and colleagues. And I still do think this is excessive tax not well justified for the following reasons: 1. I would expect a state of the art public transport in the whole country. The rail system connecting different cities in Denmark is pretty dated and slow. Even using diesel e…

Car ownership in Denmark is only marginally lower than here in the UK. And not that far behind the rest of Europe. So it obviously doesn't put off those who want a car.

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#118

Post by ljf »

vinni2 wrote: post #113
tomtimtall wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dane here. Most people can adford a car if they want one. Normalt you get a loan and pay a monthly rate over the lifetime of the car. Most people who don’t need a car however would rather save the money and use public transport or bike around. I bought a car at the inflated prices, an I wouldn’t want them lowered. I do however feel that the lower fees for electric vehicles was a good thing.

From what I observed during the time I lived in Aalborg was that families with two incomes could easily afford one car and of course for families with kids a car is very much a necessity than a luxury. While recent young graduates and immigrants could not afford a car without burning a big hole in their income.

So pretty similar to here in the UK

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#119

Post by petre »

hrasyid wrote: post #20
charlesdm wrote: post #8

Now, I don't live in Denmark, but am I the only one here who wouldn't like (excessive) tax policies like that? A 180% tax (now to be lowered a bit) on a vehicle seems madly excessive. It's like a ban, without actually having the guts to call it a ban. I'm assuming most normal people are unable to afford a car then. I'm not a car nut (don't even really like cars, though I do own one and don't use it often) but wouldn'…

If 180% is excessive, then Singapore begs to disagree: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ki51vh6ihJs Anyway, I don't think it's a ban. There are literally cars in Singapore :) If you think a regular sedan is worth >$100k (it's normal in Singapore), you can buy it. But make sure you pay for the externalities (traffic, pollution, parking, road-building, ...) that is caused by your choice.

Singapore is an overbuilt island city, to some greater extent than Hong Kong, not a country with rural areas.

Re: Soon, Cars in Denmark Will Only Be Taxed at 100% (2017)

#120

Post by petre »

Tehnix wrote: post #41
charlesdm wrote: post #8

Now, I don't live in Denmark, but am I the only one here who wouldn't like (excessive) tax policies like that? A 180% tax (now to be lowered a bit) on a vehicle seems madly excessive. It's like a ban, without actually having the guts to call it a ban. I'm assuming most normal people are unable to afford a car then. I'm not a car nut (don't even really like cars, though I do own one and don't use it often) but wouldn'…

>I'm assuming most normal people are unable to afford a car then They can actually. A new "normal" car would probably range between 60,000-150,000 DKK ($9,600-$24,000), but you could easily get an old used car for around 13,000-20,000 DKK ($2,000-$3,200). Now don't get me wrong, I certainly am not happy with the fact that we have to pay that much extra, but it is not a problem unless you want a really fancy car. For…

So basically just about anyone who doesn't want to spend anything in excess of 30k euros (15k for your average car + 15k on tax) on a car will either get an used car or a new Dacia.
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