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Chrome is Not the Standard

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Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#101

Post by komali2 »

userbinator wrote: post #30

developers grouse about the other browser makers who are “holding the web back.” Indeed, perhaps "holding the web back" is a good thing if it means websites will be more accessible overall, to even less common browsers like NetSurf, Dillo, and all the other text-based ones. IMHO the "feature war/race" between the major browser vendors has had an overall negative effect, as if all sites somehow need to turn into ridic…

I think there may even be a chicken and egg situation going on - for some reason, media websites such as CNN are pushing giant rich media content objects at us like videos, which obviously are meaningless to a text browser. Even webdev blogs are being posted with big GIFs every paragraph or two.

I'm not sure why content creators are feeling the need to go multi-media - perhaps it's getting harder and harder to tell who your audience is, or segment your audience, or maybe the "smearing" of society is causing an audience for a given topic (ES6 development, say) to have so many different desires it's impossible to create content on the subject without annoying some portion of them (either by having plain HTML and CSS for your blog post with no helpful GIFs, or a bunch of GIFs that piss off people in text browsers or slow connections).

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#102

Post by ocfx »

rubyn00bie wrote: post #10
appdrag wrote: post #3

"Safari ships new features on a much slower cadence, but they’re usually solid and always perform incredibly well." I really don't agree at all with this, Safari is the new Internet explorer ... https://www.safari-is-the-new-ie.com/

No and I think your opinion is harmful. IE literally refused to implement standards, rendered broken dom elements, allowed for proprietary native extensions and had many different apis for them. They had 90% of the market share and no other viable platforms. This meant developers built things which exploited these broken features causing huge compatibility issues when they aren’t (every other browser). A simple lack…

IE is a spectrum just like autism. Your statement is true with IE10 and below. Your statement is less true with 11 and edge.

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#103

Post by soperj »

stephenr wrote: post #43
soperj wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

flexbox isn't a bleeding edge technology, and it's supposed to work properly on safari, but it really doesn't. Annoying as hell, and garbage on their organization to be honest.

Have you submitted a bug report about it?

There have been bug reports submitted for years. Still not fixed.

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#104

Post by sgift »

notyourday wrote: post #88
yoavm wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really understand this attitude. Mozilla doesn't need to be everything I ever wanted from a browser in order to get my support. It only needs to be better than Google. Are all these people sticking with Chrome because Mozilla is not holding up to its values really think Google is better at taking care of our freedom?!

Google is transparent. I know what they are doing. I know why they are doing it. Mozilla became a shady character. It engages in "it depends on a meaning of the word 'is'" speak. Here's how Mozilla can get back into my graces - it needs to publicly FIRE whoever approved it and whoever advocated for this project.

> Google is transparent. I know what they are doing.

You do? Okay, I don't. Please, show me exactly how Google uses data they collect from their users. Every usage. Not just a few. And no "but they say they can use it for whatever they want!" - then we can talk about transparency.

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#105

Post by ChrisSD »

ebbv wrote: post #24
kevmo wrote: post #4

I know they screwed up recently with the Mr. Robot malware, but I think it's really important for developers to get behind Firefox again. As the American government fails to provide any sort of check on its behemoth corporations (Apple, Google, and Microsoft) and to protect consumer privacy, Firefox is basically the last contender for real consumer protection standing.

I get your point but considering Mozilla gets all of its funding from those same corporations I'm not sure how true that is.

Ironically its attempts to diversifying funding sources always seems to piss off the community. For example the paid slots on the new tab page that were only shown in fresh installs.

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#106

Post by chimeracoder »

sowbug wrote: post #90
cakeface wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sometimes feel like Chrome is the new Internet Explorer too! There have been a number of GSuite features from Google that don't work on Firefox. Google Hangouts for one! Also on that list was U2F auth and some others. Here we have Google products that only work on the Google browser. What does that sound like? Maybe Microsoft and all their ActiveX IE shenanigans in the past! The moral of the story, which I think th…

U2F isn't a Google product. Virtually all new major browser features are built according to standards, proposals, or explicit extensions platforms. See https://www.w3.org/TR/ , where it's very easy to map recent browser features to standards or healthy proposals. Your proselytizing would be more appropriate in Redmond, Washington in 2007. I'm not sure what gives you the impression that successful standards are develo…

> U2F isn't a Google product.

The point is that U2F on Google logins only works in Chrome. Firefox supports U2F, but Google's implementation only works with Chrome.

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#107

Post by allenz »

yoavm wrote: post #36
TAForObvReasons wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They didn't just screw up once . They've screwed up many times over the years with many projects and attempts that run counter to the core values that Mozilla claims to uphold. Bryan Lunduke articulated this very well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMALm1VthGY At this point Mozilla has to prove to us that they are worthy of our usage

I don't really understand this attitude. Mozilla doesn't need to be everything I ever wanted from a browser in order to get my support. It only needs to be better than Google. Are all these people sticking with Chrome because Mozilla is not holding up to its values really think Google is better at taking care of our freedom?!

These past episodes show that Mozilla can be tempted by money to go against their core values of user choice and privacy. Only in small ways so far, but trust is easy to lose.

If you don't like Google, you can always use Chromium or Brave. I trust them not to run marketing campaigns inside my browser.

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#108

Post by notyourday »

sgift wrote: post #104
notyourday wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google is transparent. I know what they are doing. I know why they are doing it. Mozilla became a shady character. It engages in "it depends on a meaning of the word 'is'" speak. Here's how Mozilla can get back into my graces - it needs to publicly FIRE whoever approved it and whoever advocated for this project.

> Google is transparent. I know what they are doing. You do? Okay, I don't. Please, show me exactly how Google uses data they collect from their users. Every usage. Not just a few. And no "but they say they can use it for whatever they want!" - then we can talk about transparency.

Sure it is - it markets my information to advertisers via its own platform. It is my neighborhood drug dealer, and drug are pretty good - nicely packaged and no one fucks with me when i use its drug delivery service.

Mozilla is pretending to be a health store. But we are starting to see that they are also peddling drugs. Not Google drugs - drugs with security and drugs with delivery system and drugs that we are pretty sure how they work - but some other drugs, from shady producers using shady means.

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#109

Post by microtonal »

stephenr wrote: post #35
kevmo wrote: post #4

I know they screwed up recently with the Mr. Robot malware, but I think it's really important for developers to get behind Firefox again. As the American government fails to provide any sort of check on its behemoth corporations (Apple, Google, and Microsoft) and to protect consumer privacy, Firefox is basically the last contender for real consumer protection standing.

Please tell me how Safari or Apple in general works against consumer privacy protection? This is yet again a too-simplistic view of things that seems very common with Americans. Some big companies do unethical things, and you translate that to "all big companies hate consumers and want to eat their children"

Please tell me how Safari or Apple in general works against consumer privacy protection?

Safari is pretty good at privacy protection. Apple doesn't really have an interest in collecting your data and they have a history of implementing features improving privacy (cross-site tracking protection, build-in adblock API, etc.).

The problem is that Safari is only available to the wealthiest in the world.

Re: Chrome is Not the Standard

#110

Post by bugmen0t »

bluetwo wrote: post #95
Ajedi32 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it was essentially a paid-for promotional tie-in From what I recall, it wasn't paid-for either. > we developed an unpaid collaboration to engage our users and viewers of the show in a new way Source: https://blog.mozilla.org/firefox/update-looking-glass-add/

If they didn't get paid, why on earth did they do it?

Someone actually that it was fun and valuable. Shocking, I know.
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