People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016) • Hacker News Board

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#41

Post by mrarjen » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:29 PM UTC

hycaria wrote: post #33

mrarjen wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Correct, I think it would be more effective having this change on a production level where farmers and scientists possibly work together to make meat production more sustainable by for example beter utilizing and extending grass lands in barren regions. Trick is to not make the meat more expensive...

Why not ?! It seems the most effective way to change peoples habits is still prices.

If it's more expensive the less eco friendly ways of making meat will be consumed instead.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#42

Post by peg_leg » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:29 PM UTC

mythrwy wrote: post #22

People don't believe the link between meat consumption and climate change. It seems like one leftist agenda being used to push another leftist agenda and pretty much anyone who isn't down with leftist agendas tunes right out as this is just too far fetched to even consider. (Not a heavy meat eater myself but not for planet saving reasons. I just don't like a lot of meat sitting in my stomach. Beans and whole grains a…

Science is not a leftist agenda.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#43

Post by hycaria » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:29 PM UTC

gcatalfamo wrote: post #9

What the other people don't get is that going vegan/vegetarian is NOT the correct answer.

Absolutely, the only stronger decision one can take is having one child less. But as this is not considered by most, limiting meat to one or two meals a week would already be a good step forward

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#44

Post by peg_leg » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:29 PM UTC

announcerman wrote: post #38

Only the elite should have access to meat in order to stop climate change, the rest will have to do with soybased fake meat substitutes. It's healthier too!

This is rather true.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#45

Post by ajeet_dhaliwal » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:30 PM UTC

kelchm wrote: post #11

Actually, I think you'll find that people just really like the way meat tastes.

This is it. I'm in agreement with Anthony Bourdain here about vegetarian food in most places. If I lived in India, in particular Punjab it would be far easier to be a vegetarian because stuff actually tastes great (better than meat!) but elsewhere it's hard. Being half decent isn't good enough, the vegetarian food has to taste as good as or better than meat. The worst is places where the idea of a vegetarian meal is taking the meat out of a burger and feeding people the bun and lettuce.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#46

Post by Luc » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:32 PM UTC

nerdponx wrote: post #16

kelchm wrote: post #11

Actually, I think you'll find that people just really like the way meat tastes.

It's more than that. People are very attached to their food choices, they put a lot of personal stock in what they eat. Food is an essential, ancient part of culture and society. You not only have to convince people to get over the taste, but you also have to convince people to get over the cultural importance of meat-based foods. Not so hard and some families, but probably serious challenge and many others. "Thanksg…

Culture can change. Meat consumption in Belgium is down more than 16% over 4 years: http://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf20171103_03168897 (in Dutch). This coincides with several vegetarian and 'flexitarian' campaigns.

See also: the Netherlands becoming a bicycle country thanks to a sustained effort over several generations.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#47

Post by ryanwaggoner » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:32 PM UTC

mrarjen wrote: post #24

pzone wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's needed is a carbon tax. Yes this will make meat (among other things) more expensive, but it is generally offset by the tax savings.

Yea because taxing carbon will magically get rid of it! \o/

Strawman. No one is arguing that it would magically get rid of carbon. However, incentives and prices work. If we had a global tax on carbon that accurately reflected the externalities, carbon emissions would plummet.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#48

Post by pif » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:32 PM UTC

amelius wrote: post #23

kelchm wrote: post #11

Actually, I think you'll find that people just really like the way meat tastes.

I think we should consider a rule that everybody who wants to eat an animal, has to kill it themselves. At least that will solve the mental disconnect between reality and food consumerism.

Absolutely! And everybody who wants to type a message on HN, has to build his keyboard himself. And his computer. And the internet.

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#49

Post by vixen99 » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:32 PM UTC

eastendguy wrote: post #6

People Still Don't Get the Link Between the Number of People on this Planet and Climate Change (I hardly eat meat these days, but nothing will help if the population continues to grow at the same rate)

Depends which area. Europe is dying out with a fertility rate in most parts of much less than 2.1 as required for sustained population. https://jakubmarian.com/fertility-rate-by-region-in-europe/

Re: People Don't Get the Link Between Meat Consumption and Climate Change (2016)

#50

Post by cagenut » Fri, Dec 15, 2017, 1:32 PM UTC

Meat is a big one, but its the #3 - #5ish big one depending on how you look at things (at an individual westerner vs. other lenses).

Roughly in order it goes

  - having more kids than adults (population growth)
  - living in a single-family detached home (land use sprawl + hvac inefficiency)
  - owning a car
  - flying
  - eating red meat (particularly beef & lamb)

So yes by all means, eat less red meat, but after you've moved to a multi-unit building and sold your car and stopped going to conferences.

For context, a six ounce ribeye steak is the co2 eqiv (really its methane) of 330g of emitted carbon. That is almost the exact same number of grams it costs to drive an electric vehicle on an average u.s. grid mix 2 miles. Gas burners more like 1 mile.

So ditch the car and enjoy the steak.