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The worst is yet to come for American shopping malls

money.cnn.com

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Re: The worst is yet to come for American shopping malls

#41

Post by wil421 »

csydas wrote: post #33
wil421 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m going to clear this up really quick because what OP said was extremely weird. People do not go to malls for AC and I live in the Deep South where it humid as hell. Safe Area is a weird choice of words. I guess it means parents can drop kids off at a place that has decent rent a cops. Generally keeping kids safe from themselves or weirdos I presume. My parents would’ve never said I like dropping my kids at the mal…

Well, just saying how it was where I grew up in the Midwest. Air Conditioning was not standard in many of the older houses and when there was a heatwave, people would go to malls/movie theaters and relax there because the buildings were publicly accessible, had stuff to do to kill time, and were climate controlled. I know that 102F and 99% humidity is par for the course down South, but, you know we Northerners just d…

Fair enough, I took your people who don’t have AC as something like a bunch of poor people who have no where else to go. Not people who just don’t have AC due to climate.

I also took Safe Place as a symbol for violence the media portrays in the US or something. Maybe watched too much news last night.

I understand what you were saying now!

Re: The worst is yet to come for American shopping malls

#44

Post by tomkinstinch »

zinckiwi wrote: post #6

In New Zealand and Australia (and I'm sure many other places, but those are the ones I know first-hand) malls also feature supermarkets, post offices, and banks. They're designed to be a destination for not just "recreational" shopping but day-to-day errands. Always missed that when in US malls, and apparently they're still not cottoning on.

The podcast 99% Invisible has an episode about the history of shopping malls. As conceived by Victor Gruen, a European immigrant, malls originally included these everyday places. He imagined them as "third places" for the suburbs beyond home and work. Later he became a critic of what malls became. It's worth a listen/read:

https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/the-gruen-effect/

Re: The worst is yet to come for American shopping malls

#45

Post by taneq »

flyinghamster wrote: post #35
jlebrech wrote: post #29

they need more arcades, plenty of opportunity for full 4k gaming and vr experiences that would be too expensive for many in the home.

A lot of malls started kicking out the arcades in the early 1990s, assuming they had them in the first place. Then they started kicking out the kids completely, and act surprised when they don't return after reaching adulthood.

Maybe it's also just that a mall is a place where you shop for fun, and post-gen-X there's been less general fetishizing of consumption all around.

Re: The worst is yet to come for American shopping malls

#46

Post by Karliss »

vanpeebles wrote: post #22
mseebach wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Malls have roughly the same function as "main streets" do in European towns - a relatively neutral public space - and I suspect the worry for their demise is largely the same as the worry for the demise of the main street in Europe.

The difference with malls is they are private businesses (and private property) so there are many restrictions to what the public could otherwise lawfully do on a Main Street (parades, festivals or demonstrations) - that is without express permission from the property owner.

Organizing a parade or festival on main street would also require a permit from City.

Re: The worst is yet to come for American shopping malls

#48

Post by _rpd »

black_puppydog wrote: post #4

Maybe someone from the US can clarify this for me: are people upset about this as an indicator for the economic changes happening at the moment, or are they genuinely concerned about the malls themselves? Never having left Europe myself, I could relate to the former, but not to the latter. What makes those malls so... relevant?

> What makes those malls so... relevant?

One factor not mentioned so far is that they are large employers of low skilled labor. If malls disappear, this will be one less employment option.

Re: The worst is yet to come for American shopping malls

#49

Post by tyu100 »

mattbrewsbytes wrote: post #34
tyu100 wrote: post #17

Content-free catastrophe clickbait like this is likely a good indicator that the mall-closing phenomenon in the states has peaked. Lots of the retail stores in trouble were victims of high debt loads from private equity buyouts rather than major competition from online shopping. Almost all of the major retail chains are now very competitive in online and mixed online/in-person shopping models and mall operators are r…

The other element is restaurants, I've noticed malls that have name brand chain restaurants always seem busy. People will go out to eat, and since they are there do some shopping. There are still things that are better buying in person rather than getting something shipped, not liking it, shipping it back, etc.

Yes, 'Fast Casual' in the Chipotle and Panera style has seen a huge growth boom as well as experiential retail like the Apple Store, Sephora Makeup, Alamo Drafthouse and etc..

Personally I try to buy everything online that I can't walk to and I bought a lot at Best Buy this year. They gave me free wall mount installation from their local location on my television that I bought from their web site and it's nice to have a physical location nearby for bigger purchases in case you need to return something.

In addition, the Walmarts and Targets see an obvious future where you buy things from their web stores online but just have it shipped to their physical locations where you can pick it up during your weekly grocery run. This is already a reality.

There are clear secular trends towards online shopping and against malls but a lot of the shakeout has taken place already and a lot of the weak hands have already left the game. Those that remain along with new entrants are adapting quickly which is why I think the 'retail apocalypse' has already hit the peak of the hype cycle.

Re: The worst is yet to come for American shopping malls

#50

Post by grkvlt »

Fifer82 wrote: post #5

Dan Bell's Dead Mall Series is oddly depressing and he often gives some back story into their declines. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLNz4Un92pGNxQ9vNgmnCx... A common theme appears to be either struggling footfall or the fact that what I guess are major US anchor stores (Maceys, Sears, KMart) going through tough times. Once the anchors move out, it becomes difficult to run the mall. Interestingly, in one vi…

The Rackspace head offices were built in an abandoned Texas mall (Windsor Park Mall, now The Castle, in San Antonio [0]) which is a nice recycling of an otherwise dead space...

0. https://blog.rackspace.com/get-an-inside-look-at-the-rackspa... and https://youtu.be/J4b0UlAZcH4

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