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Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

nytimes.com

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Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#11

Post by eksemplar »

djrobstep wrote: post #2

Equality of opportunity is a terrible concept. Even if we somehow solve it, it would just be shuffling people up and down the ladder of an unfair system. Instead, we should be dismantling the ladder. Real equality means equality of outcomes. Most people who talk about "equal opportunity" do so because they want to avoid talking about real equality and its implications.

People aren’t equal. When we invest our resources in the wrong people out society suffers because of it.

We’re extremely good at investing in the wrong people.

Neither way is fair, but maybe we’d be better at being unfair if we invested in the right people to lead us.

Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#12

Post by Aloha »

eksemplar wrote: post #11
djrobstep wrote: post #2

Equality of opportunity is a terrible concept. Even if we somehow solve it, it would just be shuffling people up and down the ladder of an unfair system. Instead, we should be dismantling the ladder. Real equality means equality of outcomes. Most people who talk about "equal opportunity" do so because they want to avoid talking about real equality and its implications.

People aren’t equal. When we invest our resources in the wrong people out society suffers because of it. We’re extremely good at investing in the wrong people. Neither way is fair, but maybe we’d be better at being unfair if we invested in the right people to lead us.

We culturally have a problem with the inability to accurately judge, much less even tell parents what their children are capable of, or not capable of.

In the end even with the best education, some people will grow up to be tow truck drivers, low skill factory workers, or service industry personal - its just how the split works out - not everyone is going to be super smart, some will be average, some will be below average, and some will give a wet bucket of sand a run for its money.

Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#13

Post by Aloha »

djrobstep wrote: post #2

Equality of opportunity is a terrible concept. Even if we somehow solve it, it would just be shuffling people up and down the ladder of an unfair system. Instead, we should be dismantling the ladder. Real equality means equality of outcomes. Most people who talk about "equal opportunity" do so because they want to avoid talking about real equality and its implications.

How do you ensure equal outcomes?

Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#14

Post by RcouF1uZ4gsC »

What's interesting is that the great innovations of the early 20th century, weren't by a diverse group of people. Eastern European Jews (of which Einstein was a member) produced a disproportionate amount of those discoveries. This was despite the fact that they were among the most persecuted groups in history. Because of this, I don't think that US government policy is the major reason for the differences in the article.

Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#15

Post by astr0n0m3r »

djrobstep wrote: post #2

Equality of opportunity is a terrible concept. Even if we somehow solve it, it would just be shuffling people up and down the ladder of an unfair system. Instead, we should be dismantling the ladder. Real equality means equality of outcomes. Most people who talk about "equal opportunity" do so because they want to avoid talking about real equality and its implications.

Why is equality of outcomes desirable? And how is it measurable? Or sustainable?

Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#16

Post by arkona »

Aloha wrote: post #13
djrobstep wrote: post #2

Equality of opportunity is a terrible concept. Even if we somehow solve it, it would just be shuffling people up and down the ladder of an unfair system. Instead, we should be dismantling the ladder. Real equality means equality of outcomes. Most people who talk about "equal opportunity" do so because they want to avoid talking about real equality and its implications.

How do you ensure equal outcomes?

Keeping everyone equally poor and miserable is an easy way to achieve this

Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#17

Post by tpfour »

One tangential point is that earning a scholarship seems to increase your chances of winning another. I recently heard on the local news that X student had earned a prestigious scholarship, and that he had previously won multiple others. What's the use of giving away a lot of money and recognition to someone? When is is "too much"?

Scholarship resources being limited, you should maybe get less chances to win another scholarship after winning one. Then you'd get more people with scholarships, and maybe some of them would get the confidence boost they need to actually perform instead of work stupid jobs.

One particular case I always thought was especially unethical is for some people to win scholarships and then change branches entirely. I.e. to use the scholarship for an application to med school, or law school, or whatever other program they didn't get into.

Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#19

Post by lordnacho »

> We do a pretty good job at identifying the kids who are good at throwing a football or playing a trumpet

The number of kids who are trained in sports yet never reach the professional level is absolutely enormous, and it has far-reaching consequences for them.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2017/oct/06/football-bi...

Re: Lost Einsteins: The Innovations We’re Missing

#20

Post by api »

jerkstate wrote: post #18

How does this jive with the Silicon Valley trope that ideas aren't worth very much in and of themselves, but the people and teams who can execute on them are?

That trope is sort of bullshit. Both matter.

It does apply when the idea is some kitschy social media thing but not so much when it's a real key innovation.

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