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How slot machines are designed to be addictive

theguardian.com

111–120 of 201 posts

Re: How slot machines are designed to be addictive

#111
Video game industry is pushing these tactics to new heights with loot box gamification, even better the target consumers are young, mentally underdeveloped children who are much easier to addict to gambling. China/Japan have regulated these practices for years already (with minimal effectiveness because money wins and publishers have found loopholes), but at least they're trying. Over here we just let companies go to town on our youth, mental health and stability be damned.

They are printing money at the expense of hooking children into gambling. This is no different than tobacco companies targeting children with advertisement which was rightfully outlawed. - Corporations encouraging and nourishing gambling addiction in underage consumers (with the help of trained psychologists) for profit is despicable. Don'tunderstand why more people aren't upset about this.

Re: How slot machines are designed to be addictive

#113
Sadly, the article does disservice to a lot of actual mechanics of the industry. And the amount of hard work that goes on to actually makes these games addictive. It is not for no reason that these are called one-armed bandits.

* This industry is highly regulated; but it rarely does help those really in need. If the regulations were very strictly implemented (player wager limits, player time controls, self-regulation), none of the gambling / gaming companies would make any money. For eg: the wager limit are compulsory to be implemented on a daily / weekly / monthly basis; however these numbers are so high, that it rarely makes sense but for the most serious addicts

* Most of the victims are from the already high-risk demographics, as is with tobacco, alcohol, payday loans and drug abuse, the low income, unstable jobs, low literacy, blue collar jobs or are already on social support. The offers by data-analysis is always to target them. I think most of the time - these addicts are just there to get that one chance to make a big win (which almost never happens).

* Near miss is a very old tactic. The interplay of sounds, music, imagery has been very well polished to really give a feel of high end experience (vs plain gameplay). Gamble rounds (double or nothing) at the end of a game are targeted at those twitchy fingers.

* Slot machines work at payouts of 94% - 97% (ie when wagering 1000$ the player will only get 94 - 97$) on a long timeline. So yes, the house edge is quite small. What is problematic is not the money lost but the fact that addiction over a long time, is definitely at the cost of a small fortune.

* I am pretty sure no one has any idea why some slots work and some don't. When they do work, they earn the makers millions though.

However, whenever such numbers come up, I am always sure that these tactics are no different from any industry that is fighting for coveting the attention of the user. I am pretty sure Facebook (or Zynga) has a bigger data science time and data analysis team that these casino companies have to identify the psyches of players and customize the experience to the users / players.

* Disclosure: I have worked in the technical design & implementation of these games.

Re: How slot machines are designed to be addictive

#114

Disclaimer: I design the machines and games for a living. 1) regarding near miss, with basic math knowledge you can easily calculate the odds of near miss. Eg. with 2 special symbols per 30 symbol reel, for a 3x5 reel game, you have a 1:5 chance of seeing the special symbol per reel, or once per spin for a 5 reel game. The odds of a 4 symbol near miss is (1:5)^4, which is 1:625, or once every 30 minutes. With a bank…

About point number (4) I don't think anyone said you have psychologists on call. Slot machines have been around for hundreds of years. Obviously, someone has figured out how to best make them work. The industry clearly has the know-how to make addictive games that hook players in: if it didn't, then its machines would not be as addictive as they are. Unless we want to pretend the machines got so addictive by chance,…

They certainly didn't get so addictive by chance, but not quite by design either. It's a kind of evolution, where some machines suceeed and some fail, with successful techniques carrying through to newer machines, eventually leading to hyper-optimised money making devices. Whilst not disputed that this leads to ethically dubious profits, I can see how it allows the manfuacturers a certain plausible deniability as to their intentions.

Re: How slot machines are designed to be addictive

#115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with you about the house always winning, and I also don't gamble, however you can consider the activity as a game like an arcade game where the actual playing and spending time costs money, and has value in its own right. I guess the economics is slightly more nuanced, just how you can find addictive computer games which also cost like world of Warcraft I guess

Good point, but the way I see it there are two parts to a gambling game: (a) the physical rewards (blinkenlights, twinkly noises etc) and (b) the monetary rewards. If the physical rewards were enough of a draw in and of themselves, I think we could reasonably expect there to be a market for games that don't involve money. For instance, I could imagine smaller, cheaper slot machines sold directly to players, to take t…

You've basically described a lot of mobile games though. Candy Crush for example. At first you just play for free but then cleverly they put in a level that most people can't get through so you buy the in-app purchase to let you bypass that level to get to easier addictive levels. I ended up deleting the game when I realized what was going on, but I ended up paying $20-$30 dollars before that -- it really is a similar psychological draw as to gambling -- except you can't make money in Candy Crush -- only spend it.

Re: How slot machines are designed to be addictive

#116

Disclaimer: I design the machines and games for a living. 1) regarding near miss, with basic math knowledge you can easily calculate the odds of near miss. Eg. with 2 special symbols per 30 symbol reel, for a 3x5 reel game, you have a 1:5 chance of seeing the special symbol per reel, or once per spin for a 5 reel game. The odds of a 4 symbol near miss is (1:5)^4, which is 1:625, or once every 30 minutes. With a bank…

No people don't enjoy it. If they do its your fault, that they enjoy sitting in front of a machine and pressing a button.

You are part of the problem. I really mean this. You are similar to a drug dealer, weapons producer or similar people.

You are part of an Industrie no one needs and makes our society a little bit less good every day.

And yes everyone taking part in one way or another is responsible for it.

Re: How slot machines are designed to be addictive

#117
post #113

Sadly, the article does disservice to a lot of actual mechanics of the industry. And the amount of hard work that goes on to actually makes these games addictive. It is not for no reason that these are called one-armed bandits. * This industry is highly regulated; but it rarely does help those really in need. If the regulations were very strictly implemented (player wager limits, player time controls, self-regulation…

With a mechanical slot machine I can understand the reel thing. But with electronic screens, software making up reels, how do I know that the software does not fool me even more?

Take the given example with first slot 1/16, second 1/32 and third 1/44 chance of winning big. Now assume the generated numbers are really random, and that day or week the machine has given two big prices. Then a third big number combination is created, and here a new rule takes over, changing one of the numbers so the price is smaller.

Is this regulated or how does this work?

Re: How slot machines are designed to be addictive

#118
post #113

Sadly, the article does disservice to a lot of actual mechanics of the industry. And the amount of hard work that goes on to actually makes these games addictive. It is not for no reason that these are called one-armed bandits. * This industry is highly regulated; but it rarely does help those really in need. If the regulations were very strictly implemented (player wager limits, player time controls, self-regulation…

As I write this, I think you have a typo there; 94-97% payout on $1000 is $940-970. (But I am confident it is just a typo.)

And you sort of state this, but I'd empasize that's per spin; for a $1 spin, the casino expects to make 5 cents and give back 95 cents... but then they expect you to put those 95 cents right back in with high probability, meaning that you can now expect .9025 of the original dollar, which again they expect you to put back in... it doesn't take much math to understand where this value is headed if you keep feeding the machine its own output.

I have thought before that if you must play the slots, but you want to retain the possibility of winning, the right way to do it is to take $X, and play it through the machine once, keeping all the output separated. I mean, the right right way, statistically, is to set X to 0, but if you want to play for the enjoyment or whatever and still have a chance of winning something, this seems like the best strategy.

Re: How slot machines are designed to be addictive

#119
post #52

I wonder what makes HN so addictive. I have no facebook, no twitter no reddit. And no youtube during work. But damn, I can't miss all those goodies on HN!

The same effect, novelty which presents at random is highly addictive, creating compulsive behaviour of constant checking. (Guilty over here too)

I think being an information junkie is more of the reason of HN addiction.
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