Yes, We Get Wiser with Age • Hacker News Board

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#31

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 10:40 AM UTC

skissane wrote: post #22

namelost wrote: post #2

> Empirical studies have shown that older people are better than younger ones in terms of control over emotion, knowing themselves better, making better decisions that require experience, and having more compassion and empathy towards others. These are the things I include in wisdom. So are things that are components of wisdom that can increase with aging. How does this explain Brexit? https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfro…

I think part of the explanation is cultural changes over time. The EU is very much a symbol of internationalism/globalism, even if localised into a continental context, while Brexit is a nationalistic rebellion against it. Nationalism was more popular/accepted in the past (especially so for British nationalism), so older people tend to be more sympathetic to nationalism, and hence more likely to support Brexit. Where…

[deleted]

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#32

Post by vacri » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 10:42 AM UTC

gadders wrote: post #16

dijit wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am curious too, the brexit vote for many people was an emotional one. It was certainly not based in any logic that anyone can cite. That sample is too large to be anecdatum. However to play devils advocate; leave voters were drip fed anti-EU propaganda for decades with nobody on the EU side defending it, and the run up to the referendum there was a lot of lying. So the fault may be that people were more susceptible…

Just because someone examines the same facts as you and comes to a different conclusion, it doesn't mean their choice wasn't based on facts.

How is that funding boost to the NHS going?

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#33

Post by vacri » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 10:47 AM UTC

namelost wrote: post #2

> Empirical studies have shown that older people are better than younger ones in terms of control over emotion, knowing themselves better, making better decisions that require experience, and having more compassion and empathy towards others. These are the things I include in wisdom. So are things that are components of wisdom that can increase with aging. How does this explain Brexit? https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfro…

Look at it a different way, re: empathy. 90+% of voters 65+ cared enough about the society they live in to show up to that vote. Only 64% of 18-24 and 66% of 25-39s did. How much empathy is there really, if you can't even be bothered to do something as small as showing up to vote?

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#34

Post by ksec » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 11:00 AM UTC

Recently I have been thinking about this; a lot. How do we get wiser, not smarter or cleverer much quicker then we could go with age.

I dont know if we could quantitatively measure how wise you are. So it is hard to tell if a person is wise or not. And a lot of times, you dont need to read 1000s of books, have a few DR degree or thesis to be wise. It seems wise and Intellect dont necessarily have a linear relationship.

A lot of us, might have thought about Time Traveling, like a lot of blog post telling you "Things I wish i knew" or "Things I could prepared before my startup or X". You would travel back in time and tell your younger self what to do now, what to do next, and what Not to do. But nobody came to realize, your younger self failed to understand why those decision were made, and what causes those action to be made.

One may wonder, try hard, fail hard and learn. Then you become wiser. But it doesn't seems to be the case, it seems we don't "click" until we move on to certain age / stage.

This rhymes with Zen / Buddhism loosely translated to enlightenment or awaken.

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#35

Post by notahacker » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 11:01 AM UTC

skissane wrote: post #22

namelost wrote: post #2

> Empirical studies have shown that older people are better than younger ones in terms of control over emotion, knowing themselves better, making better decisions that require experience, and having more compassion and empathy towards others. These are the things I include in wisdom. So are things that are components of wisdom that can increase with aging. How does this explain Brexit? https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfro…

I think part of the explanation is cultural changes over time. The EU is very much a symbol of internationalism/globalism, even if localised into a continental context, while Brexit is a nationalistic rebellion against it. Nationalism was more popular/accepted in the past (especially so for British nationalism), so older people tend to be more sympathetic to nationalism, and hence more likely to support Brexit. Where…

I think your "cultural change" explanation is a major factor, but there also appears to be a strong tendency for the issues the old tend to find themselves most heavily aligned against the young and most outspoken about to be those driven heavily by emotional appeal over reason. It isn't superior ability to separate facts from emotion, use of experience to inform their decisions or greater compassion that's making older people disproportionately likely to believe things like Birtherism and creationism, disbelieve things like climate change and immigrants being net contributors to the economy and find the idea their offspring might marry outside their race objectionable.

Brexit is far from the best example of this kind of divide, but even there it's noticeable that the Remain campaign focused its appeal on financial benefits, respected authorities' opinions and perceived negotiating power for better international arrangements whilst the Leave campaign talked about immigrants, authorities being "elites" and linking perceived "control" to nationhood and borders. (Admittedly the Remain campaign was neither effective nor targeted at the very youngest, but there was a marked difference in strategy. And it's also an example of where the older generation weren't so much clinging to a belief held in their youth as actively changing their mind)

I mean, to give the old their due, they're probably less susceptible to becoming members of fully-fledged personality cults than the young, and it's not as if progressive sentiments are invariably driven by reasoned consideration, but one can't help suspecting that if the old were truly wiser, their objections to certain cultural changes wouldn't manifest itself in disproportionate willingness to subscribe to nonsense like Birtherism.

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#36

Post by olfox » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 11:12 AM UTC

scbrg wrote: post #23

paganel wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does "emotion" only equal "angry" and "having a temper"? Is this also a puritan/evangelical thing? What about displays of love and tenderness? And even so, the answer to your question is most of the times "yes", at least in my case, as in I do prefer to spill it out in the heat of the moment instead of keeping it all inside. It's not wrong having "emotions" and displaying them, I though that this was established sinc…

I'm not sure where you got the idea that "control over emotions" equals "not displaying emotions". I'd say it rather equals "not acting on emotions". Situation: You are angry at a person. - Control over emotion: You tell them you're angry and why. - Lack of control: You punch them in the face. Situation: You see a person in need of help. - Control over emotion: You allocate reasonable amounts of resources to help the…

I didn't find anything about the story of the lawyer when searching. Could you tell me where to look? The story fits my preconceived notions too well to not question it...

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#37

Post by amelius » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 11:13 AM UTC

When we're young we often do foolish things not because we are fools, but because we want to explore.

At least, that's how I like to think about it.

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#38

Post by mynameishere » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 11:15 AM UTC

namelost wrote: post #2

> Empirical studies have shown that older people are better than younger ones in terms of control over emotion, knowing themselves better, making better decisions that require experience, and having more compassion and empathy towards others. These are the things I include in wisdom. So are things that are components of wisdom that can increase with aging. How does this explain Brexit? https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfro…

Well, it seems the older people were indeed wiser, more compassionate, more empathetic, thus confirming the study. Young people were mainly voting based on self-interest (ie, "I want to be able to work in Lisbon (or wherever) if a good job opens up") whereas old people were voting for the long-term independence and sovereignty of the whole nation--which would help older people the least.

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#39

Post by JBReefer » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 11:15 AM UTC

reitanqild wrote: post #30

nf05papsjfVbc wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did use the phrase "objectively worse". I see no substantiation for that yet. Also, this depends a lot on what they were looking for when they voted. I can easily say one of these: I do/don't like the outcome. However, I find it difficult to say: "they collectively chose incorrectly". I do, however, agree that in general a population deserves whatever it is that they voted for.

> However, I find it difficult to say: "they collectively chose incorrectly". That might just because you are a tolerant, reasonable person. If you were a bit more arrogant and rude like some others at this site it would be much easier for you. Source: Back when I was an even more intolerant, stupid and annoying guy I had no problems flaming whole religions or nations.

Hey, it sounds like you're wiser than you used to be, now that you're older! The rest of these posts are so arrogant, it's sad.

Re: Yes, We Get Wiser with Age

#40

Post by criddell » Thu, Sep 28, 2017, 11:18 AM UTC

jlebrech wrote: post #5

we just get more averse to bad ideas, or have heard it all before.

We also learn from our mistakes and the older we are, the more we've made.

When I think back to when I was younger (I'm 47) I realize how simplistic a lot of my beliefs were. These days I'm far more willing to listen to others and I make a lot fewer assumptions about why people do the things they do. I hope the trend continues.

I think that's why I was a little sympathetic to that Google engineer that was recently fired for his memo arguing against Google policies on diversity. After I read about what he argued, I actually said to people that he sounds very young. His recent statements about the positive aspects of the KKK reinforce that.