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China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

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Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#161

Post by teknologist »

jondubois wrote: post #116
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China has exchange controls Bitcoin is irrelevant, compared to still-tolerated and massively-more voluminous alternatives, for capital controls. This is a red herring. Bitcoin was fine until ICO promoters started pilfering from the masses. In any case, China is currently loosening its capital controls [1]. This isn’t a problem that can be constrained to China. China is just reacting first. The rebranding of this ac…

>> Pilfering from the masses. Whenever big corporations drain resources from the masses and keeps them enslaved by essentially brainwashing them; somehow that's OK. But when something comes along which offers the masses a chance for a quick (obviously high-risk) escape from slavery, that's a scam? I don't agree with how bureaucrats spin this; as though people need to be protected from themselves. Maybe the government…

The corporate brainwashing angle seems a bit far-fetched. I'd rather compare it with the endorsement of savings accounts with a 1% rate of interest and useless things like that.

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#162

Post by runeks »

kobeya wrote: post #102
tehwebguy wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well it crashed hard when rumors got serious, like $4k to $3300, but came back within like a week

It crashed from $5k.

$5k was the all-time high. Most assets crash from their all-time high, unless they're at an all-time high, of course.

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#163

Post by teknologist »

tstyle wrote: post #152
Animats wrote: post #27

So the PBOC is taking further steps to plug the leak. Not unexpected. China has exchange controls. Internal yuan cannot be easily converted to euros or dollars. There are limits on capital outflows. The controls are leaky; the classic leak is to send all your relatives to Hong Kong loaded up with the maximum allowed amount of yuan in cash. The current limit is about $50K/year/person. Small leaks are thus tolerated. B…

Is the control on the yuan really that tight? How are Chinese citizens able to buy such a massive amount of premium Seattle/SF real estate with ease? Isn't ownership of foreign real estate a big leak?

I suspect (tinfoil hat on) that the whole spiel about "capital controls" and the bitcoin thing are a clever strategy to make people buy up lots of foreign real estate instead of virtual internet coins.

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#164

Post by Quarrelsome »

sitepodmatt wrote: post #157
tryingagainbro wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bitcoin is irrelevant, compared to still-tolerated and massively-more voluminous alternatives, for capital controls. This is a red herring. At one point all crypto had reached $160B in market cap. Not small at all and risked getting much larger. Lesson #1: if China wants something done they will do it. No courts, no public discussion, nothing. Don't be surprised if these execs end up in jail.

It's refreshing that a country can act this quickly even if we don't agree with the action. In many countries this would require several meeting of understanding, a dozen committees forming sub-committees, accusations of corruptions and biased interest and several related court cases, and endless other shit. IMO it's actually a very smart move, to ensure a fair and complete dissolution, and if those execs dont have t…

> It's refreshing that a country can act this quickly

I'll remind you of how refreshing it is when I drag your family off the gulag without warrant. Its not "refreshing", its scary.

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#165

Post by sitepodmatt »

Quarrelsome wrote: post #164
sitepodmatt wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's refreshing that a country can act this quickly even if we don't agree with the action. In many countries this would require several meeting of understanding, a dozen committees forming sub-committees, accusations of corruptions and biased interest and several related court cases, and endless other shit. IMO it's actually a very smart move, to ensure a fair and complete dissolution, and if those execs dont have t…

> It's refreshing that a country can act this quickly I'll remind you of how refreshing it is when I drag your family off the gulag without warrant. Its not "refreshing", its scary.

First off - no one has been dragged off, they are merely preventing the exchange operators (that are originally resident in China anyway) from leaving the country until they execute an orderly shutdown. i.e. No holidays for now, we don't want you doing a MarkK. Also, we are talking China here not NK, but don't let the facts get in the way of your point. Btw, you do have "temporary injunctions" in other parts of the world too.

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#166

Post by tvanantwerp »

rumcajz wrote: post #51
gggdvnkhmbgjvbn wrote: post #5

All comments so far have been pro-bitcoin... does nobody think this could actually be a sensible decision?

Here you go: Have you ever heard of capital flight from Russia? Oligarchs sell oil then then purchase houses in London or Manhattan. The country is gradually hollowed out. China, OTOH, is trying to keep the money at home.

China might have an easier time discouraging capital flight if it weren't the sort of place where entrepreneurs have to worry about their entire industries becoming illegal and possibly finding themselves in jail overnight.

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#167

Post by bonzini »

rblatz wrote: post #90
WhoIsSatoshi wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you buy the bitcoins without the state tracking you? FYI the US is doing that also, you cannot buy on coinbase without providing ID... they want to be able to track big buyers.

You could mine, even if it was unprofitable. Spending 10 million in mining costs to produce $5million in bitcoin is still a win for a lot of people trying to move money out of China.

The largest mining pools were based on China.

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#168

Post by seanmcdirmid »

AlexCoventry wrote: post #144
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure. But it still can't grow forever without dragging down the real economy, at some point soon growth has to stop, and then what?

From the PRC's perspective, the yuan is a just a tool to stimulate productive activity in their population towards the goals expressed in state budgets. If they can muster the political will, they can simply levy highly progressive taxes to reduce inflation and keep on spending. There is nothing stopping them, ideologically.

If growth is mostly currently debt fueled, that growth can easily stop and reverse when the debt is pulled back. Recession at best, depression at worst, definitely there will be a few crashes along the way.

Do you think real estate can really be sustained at it's current levels? Much of it has been bought as a speculative asset (no property taxes makes that easy) with the idea that it can only keep going up because of urbanization. However, farmers are generally poor not rich, it is not clear where the "bigger idiots" are going to come from.

China's tax burden is already high for those that pay them. Going after those that don't at the high end is difficult because they tend to be officials or highly connected to officials in the first place.

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#169

Post by Chris2048 »

sitepodmatt wrote: post #165
Quarrelsome wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's refreshing that a country can act this quickly I'll remind you of how refreshing it is when I drag your family off the gulag without warrant. Its not "refreshing", its scary.

First off - no one has been dragged off, they are merely preventing the exchange operators (that are originally resident in China anyway) from leaving the country until they execute an orderly shutdown. i.e. No holidays for now, we don't want you doing a MarkK. Also, we are talking China here not NK, but don't let the facts get in the way of your point. Btw, you do have "temporary injunctions" in other parts of the w…

> no one has been dragged off

same is as true for N. Korea

Re: China Bans Bitcoin Executives from Leaving Country, Miners “Preparing for Worst”

#170

Post by nemo44x »

adrianratnapala wrote: post #60
samstave wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would they ban blue cheese? Is drug use high among foreigners or is that just a harrassement control to keep them in mental check, so they fear the unpredictability of the government and the power they hold over individual fate?

My guess is food safety. Not quite real food safety, but also not made up. Some European cheeses are not available in here Australia because of regulations about how dairy products have to be processed (Pasteurisation I guess). Not only might that logic work in China too, but the culture is less tolerant of a food-stuff what is after all curdled milk with a fungal infection. (And we in the west get grossed out by chi…

In the west we eat a lot more chicken feet than people think. Nearly any decent chicken stock is going to be made in part with chicken feet as they provide a lovely gelatinous component to the stock.
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