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My Family’s Slave

theatlantic.com

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Re: My Family’s Slave

#431

Post by TeMPOraL »

lettergram wrote: post #405
int_19h wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The left is not a hivemind. There are people who self-identify as liberals but not progressives, and there are people who self-identify as progressives but not liberals, and there's those who mix and match.

Ive actually noticed that really there appears to be a pretty interesting split between progressives and conservatives. Leaving the middle "liberals" (really from both sides) caught in an awkward situation. For example, being liberal usually implies greater freedoms, such as being pro-choice. However, it can also be pro-gun ownership, or anti-war, pro-research, etc. To me that's the dichotomy the U.S. is facing is re…

I think those labels aren't really helpful when discussing individuals. A lot of people are in pretty much every part of the political spectrum simultaneously.

In fact, I prefer to classify political views differently, by splitting them into two buckets: those who have figured out that every issue needs an actually effective solution, and those who follow their ideologies blindly.

Re: My Family’s Slave

#432

Post by hnaccount123 »

Someone commented on twitter that it's weird how much he empathizes and is complicit with his mom, especially after owning a slave. He also points out that he mentions she worked at Fairview Training Center, which doesn't exactly have a good history - http://www.oregonlive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2010/01/erasing_...

Usually I feel like pointing out these things is sort of not understanding the perspective, but also after reading Lola's obituary (http://o.seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2016807437...) it seems like Alex Tizon resolves himself of a lot of the responsibility for the cruel things his mother has done. Am I missing something here or does this seem to humanize her cruel actions a little bit too much...

Re: My Family’s Slave

#433

Post by gambiting »

anovikov wrote: post #383
creepydata wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>neither men nor women really have the option of just "being a housewife." We kind of both have to work....in most marriages, both people have to work. Says who? Sure if you take out a fat mortgage and car loans that require two incomes to repay then, sure, you need two incomes. But you can also just choose to live in a smaller house and drive cheaper cars instead. The issue is the lifestyle inflation that comes with…

I think you are typing this sitting at your comfortable 1% Valley workplace. Nowhere in the world does $55K a year before tax provide anywhere like 'good life'. It means endless misery and generational psychological poverty passed on to your children. Only reason of doing it is if your desire to exert psychological pressure on your wife is greater than even desire to consume. It simply doesn't sound healthy, and it i…

Maybe you should stick your nose outside a bit more often? In Poland if you make ~$20k/year you are super rich, can easily afford to not just buy but build a new house. There's absolutely nothing miserable about it. Saying that "nowhere in the world" $55k provides a good life is just hilariously wrong.

Even in UK, I make ~$35k before tax and I'm living a very comfortable life.

Re: My Family’s Slave

#434

Post by isostatic »

lettergram wrote: post #405
int_19h wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The left is not a hivemind. There are people who self-identify as liberals but not progressives, and there are people who self-identify as progressives but not liberals, and there's those who mix and match.

Ive actually noticed that really there appears to be a pretty interesting split between progressives and conservatives. Leaving the middle "liberals" (really from both sides) caught in an awkward situation. For example, being liberal usually implies greater freedoms, such as being pro-choice. However, it can also be pro-gun ownership, or anti-war, pro-research, etc. To me that's the dichotomy the U.S. is facing is re…

Same issue in the Uk. Momentum (militant whacko commies) have been trying to claim everyone who is against May and her various ruinous policies should vote for Corbyn and his various ruinous policies.

Fortunately in the UK there's another voice at the table in between the extremes. People tend not to vote for them because of fear, and a misunderstanding of the soft power available in politics.

Re: My Family’s Slave

#435

Post by johndotsun »

DashRattlesnake wrote: post #305
blackbagboys wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You understand that you are now complicit in her abuse, yes? You understand that you are an accomplice to this crime?

> You understand that you are now complicit in her abuse, yes? You understand that you are an accomplice to this crime? FFS, you literally know next to nothing about the situation. Why do you feel like you're in a position to self righteously adjudicate him as being a criminal? None of us, not even lordnacho himself, know enough about his friend's housekeeper to legitimately make claims like that (or casually throw a…

>Seriously, the housekeeper's situation may not be too far off from the archetypal startup employee working 18 hour days and sleeping under his desk. None of us know, and none of us should claim to know.

Do you really believe that some 23 year old fresh out of college programmer working 18 hours days by choice in hopes of either a significant payoff or at least experience that will anyways lead to a very well compensated job is at all similar to a women who is sleeping on a mat in the kitchen of an empty house full of empty rooms who is then woken up every morning by a phone call explicitly designed to be demeaning so that she can start her menial, low payoff, worthless experience work?

Re: My Family’s Slave

#436

Post by gadders »

throwaway66494 wrote: post #216

My family adopted my female cousin nearly 30 years ago from Guatemala. The country was in civil war at the time so bringing her to the U.S. was in her best interest. Unfortunately my mother and aunt (sisters of her birth father) kept her so locked down that she is effectively a slave. My aunt hasn't worked in decades because my little sister has always signed every paycheck over to my aunt. After working for nearly 2…

I have no helpful advice, but MAN some people are evil. I can't think of another word for it.

Re: My Family’s Slave

#437

Post by vostok »

gambiting wrote: post #433
anovikov wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you are typing this sitting at your comfortable 1% Valley workplace. Nowhere in the world does $55K a year before tax provide anywhere like 'good life'. It means endless misery and generational psychological poverty passed on to your children. Only reason of doing it is if your desire to exert psychological pressure on your wife is greater than even desire to consume. It simply doesn't sound healthy, and it i…

Maybe you should stick your nose outside a bit more often? In Poland if you make ~$20k/year you are super rich, can easily afford to not just buy but build a new house. There's absolutely nothing miserable about it. Saying that "nowhere in the world" $55k provides a good life is just hilariously wrong. Even in UK, I make ~$35k before tax and I'm living a very comfortable life.

Let's not ahead of ourselves. Earning $20k in Poland does not make you super rich. It's probably like making $100k in the US excluding NY, SF, similar places. Statistically, you're rich, but you won't feel that way.

Re: My Family’s Slave

#438

Post by galfarragem »

throwaway66494 wrote: post #216

My family adopted my female cousin nearly 30 years ago from Guatemala. The country was in civil war at the time so bringing her to the U.S. was in her best interest. Unfortunately my mother and aunt (sisters of her birth father) kept her so locked down that she is effectively a slave. My aunt hasn't worked in decades because my little sister has always signed every paycheck over to my aunt. After working for nearly 2…

I think you already did the first step: you were courage enough to speak about the problem, even if anonymously. Now that your mother has died, you only need to fight your aunt where blood bonds are much weaker.

Don't stop now: your sister needs you and your mind needs peace.

Re: My Family’s Slave

#439

Post by Jabanga »

achou wrote: post #141

Truly remarkable story. One thing that struck me is that Lola did so much of the work of a traditional mother's role: raising the kids, cooking, cleaning, laundry, and even providing emotional support. The mother had to take on a traditional father's role in bringing home an income. And the actual father - well, he did neither role and seemed to just freeload, gamble, abuse, and finally disappear. All of the work in…

The traditional mother's role is compensated. They have their expenses, like heating, electricity, shelter and groceries, paid for by the breadwinner.

They are of course not compensated for what they provide their children, but the same applies to the breadwinner, whose expenditures on the children are not compensated. That's what child-rearing is: an expense in money and/or time.

This is not exclusive to the "capitalist system", and it does not just apply to the traditional mother's role.

Re: My Family’s Slave

#440

Post by dennisgorelik »

achou wrote: post #429
Camillo wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Women actually control the majority of discretionary spending, and not because they make more money. The fact that there is no contract does not mean the work is not compensated.

Needless to say, spending and income are two different things. This is very easy to see if, for example, one spouse loses their job and the other continues to do exactly the same housework and child rearing -- but now can spend much less.

> but now can spend much less.

... or more (for the same amount of homework), if her spouse started earning more.

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