Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

economist.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

421–430 of 467 posts

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#421

Post by Consultant32452 »

pm90 wrote: post #398
Consultant32452 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't speak for all major US tech companies, but I can speak for my experience at a major US financial firm, household name, etc. A couple years ago they did the old dump the American devs and move everything to India. I'm the American team lead. The difference, as far as I can tell, is that the time to market for new features has doubled or tripled. This isn't because the Indian devs/QA are lower quality, they're…

I'm genuinely sorry about your situation. It seems like this is one of those cases in which management couldn't resist the short-term cost savings. I would wager this is a pretty common occurrence and I can see where you're coming from...and I completely agree. In this case its most likely not going to work out in the long term.

It actually doesn't bother me at all. In my younger days I cared a lot more about working on exciting/interesting projects. Now I care most about the fact that I'm 100% telecommute and have 6 weeks of vacation. Others may have had a different experience, but years of consulting have taught me to divorce myself from being emotionally attached to clients. I go in, give them my best advice and work, then go home. If they shoot themselves in the foot, then that's on them.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#422

Post by sctb »

txmx2000 wrote: post #140

Americans don't get PhDs because graduate schools are flooded with applications from those trying to gain entry to the US. Once in industry foreigners tend to hire only members of their own race further discouraging Americans from pursuing advanced degrees. I think it's disgusting that you say you're contributing to my country as though, without you, these positions would go unfilled because Americans aren't intellig…

We detached this flagged subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14144409.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#423

Post by s73ver »

bingomad123 wrote: post #152
molyss wrote: post #10

"Given that the unemployment rate for college graduates sits at 2.5%, it is fair to say that most native workers displaced by H-1Bs land on their feet." That's completely ignoring the fact that if you have cheaper workers, you end up being underpaid and/or doing a job you'd rather not be doing. Unemployment rate alone don't tell the whole story, and failing to acknowledge that sounds like poor/partial journalism to m…

> That's completely ignoring the fact that if you have cheaper workers Cheaper labor is good just like cheaper raw material. Trump wants American companies to buy expensive American steel instead of cheaper Japanese or Chinese steel of same quality. This is a net loss for American economy and a state sponsored coercive benefit for the American Steel industry. Personally it is both productive and economically benefici…

"Cheaper labor is good"

Not for the vast majority of Americans who's only source of income is selling their labor (physical, creative, intellectual, etc).

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#424

Post by s73ver »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #145
nullnilvoid wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. The current system has been abused by Indian out-sourcing companies such as TCS, Infosys. The vast majority of highly skilled workers cannot get H-1B visas at all.

As abhorrent as the situation is, the body shops are only taking advantage of a legal windfall that American corporate greed has lobbied for. The system has been rigged. You can't completely blame the actors taking advantage of it.

"You can't completely blame the actors taking advantage of it."

Why not? Are they not run by adults? Are those adults not capable of taking responsibility for their own actions?

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#425

Post by mi100hael »

s73ver wrote: post #424
kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As abhorrent as the situation is, the body shops are only taking advantage of a legal windfall that American corporate greed has lobbied for. The system has been rigged. You can't completely blame the actors taking advantage of it.

"You can't completely blame the actors taking advantage of it." Why not? Are they not run by adults? Are those adults not capable of taking responsibility for their own actions?

Technically they are legally (and arguably morally) obligated to act in the best interests of the business on behalf of the shareholders who own it. It's up to the govt. and the market to define what falls under "best interests."

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#426

Post by aanm1988 »

jordanb wrote: post #291
aanm1988 wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm starting to find the "indentured servitude" thing really pretty irritating. Comparing being a highly paid tech worker with some issues changing jobs to an illegal form of (essentially) slavery is ridiculous. I also don't really see how either act causes the problems you are describing.

Indentured Servitude is exactly the relationship that exists for many on H1-B. It's not even hyperbole. This is especially true for people trying to get a green card. The employer can use the green card process to ensure the worker has no career mobility. And this process can take many years. Interestingly it is NOT Tata/Infosys/WIPRO who are using the green card trick. They don't sponsor green cards. They just rotat…

Indentured servitude was a system where you would enter into a basically unbreakable contract to work in exchange for passage to america (specific case, but general idea). Once you got here the captain of the ship would sell off the contract to whoever and that person basically owned you until it was done. You don't get to quit, they will have someone hunt you down and bring you back. You are not much more than a slave until you finish the contract.

There was good reasons why it was outlawed along with slavery in the 13th amendment.

Having to jump through some hoops to switch jobs, or having to leave the country if you quit/get fired is not nearly the same thing. Not even close.

Getting an I140 takes about a year, and you can transfer it after 180 days. Yes it takes a long time for Indians to get the actual card. That's not a result of companies trying to get you into servitude, it's a result of poor immigration policy and massive demand from India.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#427

Post by notyourwork »

vecinu wrote: post #171
notyourwork wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (how easy is it to replace a CS PhD working on LIDARs for self driving cars?) I have no problem with specializations but how many are in the US doing full stack web or general application development. It seems to me the problem is not surrounding engineers who specialize in a minority field like LIDAR. The problem is when you have a team of 15 engineers building a web application platform and 13 are H1Bs. Also, don…

> doing full stack web Is there really an abundance of really qualified full stack web developers? I met a lot of incompetent US citizens claiming to be full stack devs.

> I met a lot of incompetent US citizens claiming to be full stack devs.

Does this imply that H1B employee's are guaranteed to be more competent? I don't think it does and also extrapolating your experience to conclude on an entire population of people is hardly justified.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#428

Post by clairity »

rayiner wrote: post #367
clairity wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"This hurts the people brought in (they are stuck in bad jobs with bad pay and no way out)." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ i agree with everything you said except for this part. many of the indian workers are still better off economically than they might otherwise be, even if they are not as well off as their american counterparts. in any case, we should let every person seeking higher education in the US work indefinitely in this…

> in any case, we should let every person seeking higher education in the US work indefinitely in this country, not just PhDs. in fact, anyone who wants to work hard should be allowed in. all such workers will accrue a net economic benefit, as the new workers will generate more value than they consume. A country is more than just an economy of value-producing workers.

yes, absolutely. the kinds of folks that uproot themselves to move to a new country and culture to make a better life also tend to be interesting and add cultural richness as well. =)

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#429

Post by AdrianB1 »

pm90 wrote: post #87
s73ver wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except the market already tried that, with pretty poor results.

What exactly do you mean? All the major US tech companies (and plenty of minor ones as well) have huge India offices. If they were delivering "pretty poor results", they wouldn't still be operating.

Working in a (top-50) Fortune 500 company, not tech but in the IT dept: we did outsourcing, CIO and top guys got huge bonuses, now we do in-sourcing to be able to operate. Last CIO recently fired. Entire teams of people based in India, Costa Rica or Manila closed, the skills and productivity are simply not good enough.

Re: H-1B visas mainly go to Indian outsourcing firms

#430

Post by [deleted] »

HeavenBanned wrote: post #143
nandemo wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article is talking about college graduates in general. The study you linked to is about young college graduates (age 21 to 24).

I graduated in 2011 with a non-STEM degree, and I still don't have a job. I won't be employed until 2020 at this rate (in pursuit of a C.S. M.S.). The "job numbers" after the Great Derecession are lies. Pure lies. The unemployment rate is probably more closer to 25%. You can't survive in this economy if it's not STEM. A lot of people here defending the H1-Bs sadly. One guy said "if you can't compete in this economy g…

[deleted]
Post reply on HN