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Make America Hate Again

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Re: Make America Hate Again

#171

Post by Avshalom »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #50
metafunctor wrote: post #3

I know what "hate" means. I know what bigotry is, and I know what racism means. Don't you?

No. I'm told I'm racist because I think blacks and whites are interchangeable, and because I don't care about one over the other. I'm told I'm racist for thinking the opposite. I'm told it's racist to discriminate on the basis of race. I'm also told it's racist NOT to do so. The closest principle I can find that predicts who is considered a racist is "republican = racist". Can you provide a clear definition of racism…

Sometimes when you cut some one open and take out body parts it's called murder.

Sometimes when you cut some one open and take out body parts it's called surgery.

CONTEXT MATTERS

Re: Make America Hate Again

#172

Post by davexunit »

reitanqild wrote: post #160
metafunctor wrote: post #3

I know what "hate" means. I know what bigotry is, and I know what racism means. Don't you?

Maybe we are not talking about you. We are talking about people who went around, even here on HN, telling that half the American population were dumb racist haters because they either voted Trump or IIRC just because they respected the election.

If you voted for Trump you are, at the very least, okay with electing a racist, sexist, xenophobic authoritarian.

And half the American population did not vote for Trump.

Re: Make America Hate Again

#173

Post by humanrebar »

sharemywin wrote: post #112
selllikesybok wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd start here - https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/racism #1 leads to #3 leads to #2. But there is a lot more to it. Not a simple concept. There is a lot of reading to do if you'd like to understand more. Can provide some links.

I know this is going to come off like a "smart ass" But, I really curious what people think. Can someone be a bigot towards racists? I've heard the argument that the left is intolerant of intolerance and there for hypocritical, which sort of on it's face sounds plausible but seems more like an alt-fact to me. But I can't put my finger of why. It kind of reminds me of the time I was arguing with my brother and his res…

> How do you deal with people that refuse to argue with logic and facts?

This is a good point, and circles back to the original thought in this thread. When words are unclear, how can you discuss logic and facts? People don't have the patience (nor should they) to sit down and cooperatively define dozens of key terms each time they have a meaningful discussion about the direction of society, culture, and government.

Relabeling and redefining things to assert power (instead of reasoning with others) inhibits cooperative reason and is therefore, in my mind, irrational and harmful.

Re: Make America Hate Again

#174

Post by grzm »

pluma wrote: post #168
akvadrako wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you mean by "racist"? If you mean discriminating based on race, then of course, everybody is racist. Haven't you seen those videos of babies that cry the first time they encounter a face of a different color?

I cried as a baby the first time I was put in a group with other babies (most likely of the same color as me). I think the word you're looking for is xenophobia. And while xenophobia certainly isn't any less of a problem, calling it racism makes it sound far more grandiose than it really is. Racism is a political (and ideological) issue. Feminists define racism in terms of power dynamics. Supremacists use racism to a…

I think xenophobia is used to express something much stronger than just bias.

Re: Make America Hate Again

#175

Post by 203812031 »

mikeash wrote: post #96
_xhok wrote: post #2

I agree with his stance on this, and I think Trump and his latest executive orders are awful, but I also think that at this point, "hatred," "bigotry," and "racism" should be excised from public discourse. These are labels. No one really knows what "hate" means anymore, but because people are emotional, they see the word, recall what they think of Trump, and think, "yeah, that's hateful!" This is a problem for two re…

While we're banning these other words, can we also ban "virtue signaling"? It basically means "you are being insincere" and is just as unproductive.

"Virtue signaling" is just a modern term for an age old concept. Yesterday someone mentioned that he wanted to know the morbid people using this term (paraphrased).

It turns out that Jesus was one of those morbid people, criticizing the Pharisees and hypocrisy (preaching water and drinking wine).

Hypocrisy permeates business and politics, so while "virtue signaling" is perhaps overused, it is nonetheless a useful catch phrase. You can also use it against the right, if you wish.

Trump holding a rifle on stage is also virtue signaling.

Re: Make America Hate Again

#176

Post by Shivetya »

CATO has a nice five point list as to why Congress should act. https://www.cato.org/blog/five-reasons-congress-should-repea...

however not all actions asking for caution are hate related, let alone bigotry or such. You can portray them that way if you like but that is you.

lastly, why is this on HN?

Re: Make America Hate Again

#177

Post by davexunit »

overcast wrote: post #127
joekrill wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, the majority of Americans did NOT vote for this. Even the majority that actually voted didn't vote for this.

Oh boy, not this again. The majority of the electoral college voted for this. That's how both Trump, and Hillary campaigned. To maximize electoral votes. There is no way to predict how it would have turned out, if it was based on popular vote.

Oh get the fuck out of here with that bullshit. The majority of the American people did not and still do not want Trump.

Re: Make America Hate Again

#178

Post by masterponomo »

zzleeper wrote: post #150
masterponomo wrote: post #124

In the 1990's in Gwinnett County, GA, you could not enroll your child in school unless he/she had a Social Security number. Non-citizens (including illegal aliens) were exempt from this rule. I considered declaring my children non-citizens as a minor protest, but really didn't care to make an issue of it. Would today's hysterics classify that 1990's policy as hatred, bigotry, and racism agains the (then) largely whit…

Are you implying that asking for SSN was being racist against white people? More likely than not, they just wanted everyone to have a SSN so they required it for kids. But non-residents cannot have SSNs (even if legally there), so they had to make an exemption for them. In a way, you can argue the opposite. By making sure that kids have SSNs, they get access to credit and much more, while those without SSNs get stuck…

No. I am asking those hysterical about recent events to tell me why one form of selective enforcement is accepted as a matter of course, while another is not. I am using this example to show that selective enforcement of laws is not automatically hatred/bigotry/racism, but may be a matter of different policy goals. BTW, aliens can get ITIN's which are similar to SSN's except they are used only for tax matters. That is another abuse of citizens, if you care to be rigorous. Citizens are required to obtain a number and to supply it as a condition of receiving a benefit. In effect, the dreaded "show me your papers" which is posited as an abuse of power if used against a suspected illegal alien standing on the street is an entry requirement for a born citizen to walk through the door of kindergarten--but not for any non-citizen.

Re: Make America Hate Again

#179

Post by yummyfajitas »

panglott wrote: post #151
yummyfajitas wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. I'm told I'm racist because I think blacks and whites are interchangeable, and because I don't care about one over the other. I'm told I'm racist for thinking the opposite. I'm told it's racist to discriminate on the basis of race. I'm also told it's racist NOT to do so. The closest principle I can find that predicts who is considered a racist is "republican = racist". Can you provide a clear definition of racism…

The US is a racist society: "race" has no valid biological basis, but is a salient social category which impacts social and economic interactions in a wide variety of ways, producing inequalities of privilege and injustice. Whether or not you have bigotry in your heart is beside the point—no one can know such things. When you spend all your energy trying to prove that you are untainted and innocent of racism, it seem…

I don't know what you mean by "racist". Can you provide a clear and unambiguous definition? I don't think you can.

Re: Make America Hate Again

#180

Post by yummyfajitas »

Avshalom wrote: post #171
yummyfajitas wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. I'm told I'm racist because I think blacks and whites are interchangeable, and because I don't care about one over the other. I'm told I'm racist for thinking the opposite. I'm told it's racist to discriminate on the basis of race. I'm also told it's racist NOT to do so. The closest principle I can find that predicts who is considered a racist is "republican = racist". Can you provide a clear definition of racism…

Sometimes when you cut some one open and take out body parts it's called murder. Sometimes when you cut some one open and take out body parts it's called surgery. CONTEXT MATTERS

Murder is the unlawful and premeditated killing of one person by another.

Surgery is the treatment of injuries or disorders of the body by incision or manipulation, especially with instruments.

Racism is ___?

Please fill in the blanks so I can apply your definition to an action/belief together with it's associated context.

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