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Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

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Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#71

Post by ryanlol »

smrtinsert wrote: post #64
ryanlol wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>because he courted extremely controversial figures like David Duke. Did he? I haven't really followed this, but I can't remember seeing anything even remotely suggesting this.

He regularly retweeted white nationalist posts.

David Duke was specified, even though all evidence points toward that accusation being entirely fabricated.

It seems like he used to retweet lots of random people, was he regularly retweeting any specific white nationalists or specifically white nationalist content?

Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#72

Post by pdimitar »

1337biz wrote: post #51
pdimitar wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eastern Europe. Our people are one of the most chill folk in the world (together with parts of Turkey and the Nordic countries, IMO) and as long you're not living off of welfare people will judge you by how you act towards them. Not to mention most of us are very hospitable and open. Disclaimer: I am from Bulgaria. I've met countless Americans, a lot of British, loads of Eastern Europeans, some Nordics, some Turks an…

But don't you always have to suck up to the US so your country doesn't end up getting Crimea'ed?

Maybe. 99% of us don't know and don't care.

Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#73

Post by pdimitar »

barrkel wrote: post #58
pdimitar wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eastern Europe. Our people are one of the most chill folk in the world (together with parts of Turkey and the Nordic countries, IMO) and as long you're not living off of welfare people will judge you by how you act towards them. Not to mention most of us are very hospitable and open. Disclaimer: I am from Bulgaria. I've met countless Americans, a lot of British, loads of Eastern Europeans, some Nordics, some Turks an…

I spent about 24 hours in Bulgaria. I arrived by train in a sleeper carriage, where we (my GF and I) were pick-pocketed while sleeping. As we wandered around Sofia, I caught another pickpocket, a woman, trying to undo the zip on my shoulder bag. I couldn't wait to get out of Bulgaria. It will be a long time before I voluntarily revisit.

Pickpockets are everywhere. Don't generalize.

I'll agree however that unless you live in several parts of Sofia (the capital) the rest of the city -- and the country -- can be easily defined as a poverty-stricken sh*thole. =)

Let's just say I live in the bubble of the middle class and for that Bulgaria is pretty much perfect.

EDIT: You should absolutely avoid the trains in Bulgaria. Buses, planes, or walking. Not joking.

Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#74

Post by pdimitar »

Pigo wrote: post #60
pdimitar wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eastern Europe. Our people are one of the most chill folk in the world (together with parts of Turkey and the Nordic countries, IMO) and as long you're not living off of welfare people will judge you by how you act towards them. Not to mention most of us are very hospitable and open. Disclaimer: I am from Bulgaria. I've met countless Americans, a lot of British, loads of Eastern Europeans, some Nordics, some Turks an…

Interesting anecdote, never thought I'd hear a sales pitch for moving to Eastern Europe. But I must admit I've grown to appreciate the zero fucks given that is Eastern Europe. I miss when the Internet was the wild west, and used for circumventing bullshit. Now it's become where bullshit is born. I want to run naked in the streets covered in green jello (a la Denis Leary) every time I'm forced to look at social media.…

I can't generalize a country where I dislike a good chunk of the people -- but for what it's worth, people are busy, they go on about their lives and they rarely judge you out of nowhere. Posers and idiots do exist on the media, just like everywhere else -- that's a way to make money you know (no such thing as negative advertisement).

But the common folk is incredibly bullshit-resistant and that makes living in this country a bless for people who need the peace of mind.

Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#75

Post by __jal »

georgespencer wrote: post #48
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Austrian side of my family fled Anschluss [1]. Within this context, the hyperbolic ("I am upset about our political system") and literal ("I will likely be killed soon") uses of the term "fascist" are meaningful. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anschluss

One of the most disappointing things about the last election cycle in the U.S. and Brexit here in the U.K. has been people happily accepting euphemism and hyperbole as part of political/social rhetoric. Maybe it's been happening for a while, but to me it felt like a sudden shift. Bannon is a "white supremacist" because he was accused of making a single antisemitic remark by his ex-wife, during divorce proceedings, wh…

The solution is not to overcorrect and massively downplay.

The reaction to Bannon is not because of a single incident. Go peruse breitbart.com to take in some of his editorial direction - be sure to check the 'black crime' tag.

The reaction to Trump is not about a bland policy disagreement; the reaction is to claims of "Mexican rapists" and promises (revokable depending on moon-phase, apparently) to target Muslim immigrants specifically.

You are correct that nobody is firing up the Zyclon-B factories right now, and nobody knows what will actually happen. But concerns about the use of hyperbole cannot be an excuse to downplay people's clear words and actions. Doing so falls for a rhetorical strategy called the Overton Window that's been used successfully for quite some time. Look it up if you're not familiar with it, and view the history of a hot-button issue of your choosing through that lens. It works, and it leads to extremism.

Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#77

Post by kahrkunne »

Certhas wrote: post #39
kahrkunne wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think you can describe the democratic election of a president who wants smaller, not bigger government as "fascism". It suggests a pretty poor understanding of the fact that fascism is pretty narrowly defined, and not another word for "thing I don't like"

No but Trump was/is promising to jail the opposition, promising to curb freedom of press, and generally using the language of fascism. I recently read for the first time Burkes rhetorical analysis of Hitlers Mein Kampf: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rhetoric_of_Hitler's_%22Ba... These tropes show up all over political speech of course, but I think it is undeniable that Trump has pulled together an unusually large…

Well you know, that opposition did commit actual crimes on multiple occasions, and that free press did conspire against him...

Being the opposition doesn't make you exempt from justice, and being the press doesn't mean you can lie (more like the opposite)

There's many things wrong with Trump, but these things aren't among them. (the things that are are "the wall", his conflict of interest, his stance on climate change)

I consider myself a proud Trump supporter, but I also think there's things about him we need to question and watch out for - and comparing him to fascists or casting undue doubt on the legitimacy of the election is just distracting from the real important things. For the sake of both "camps" (though I hate to see the world divided up like that - we're all on the same side, really) I wish we could stop this nonsense and focus on the future.

But I'm going off topic, so I'll leave it at that.

Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#78

Post by JumpCrisscross »

thenomad wrote: post #55
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work with some wealthy people. This is a fun topic and favourite topic--if the U.S. fell to fascism, where would you go. The most popular answe is Argentina. The most interesting is Kerala.

Fascinating! I wouldn't have called either of those. Why Argentina?

> Why Argentina?

Same core reasons as Kerala [1]. You're looking for places which would remain stable if America collapsed and where America would have a hard time projecting influence if it didn't.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13276490

Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#79

Post by 086421357909764 »

nothrabannosir wrote: post #45
dandelion_lover wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>just documented history People from HN expect links when you use such words. Could be the reason for downvotes I guess.

There is a point where that stops, no? I mean we don't provide links to the wikipedia page for the Holocaust... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_Tibetan_program

The holocaust is also a widely know historical incident where as Tibet's struggles, while known by a few, aren't as wide nor as strong a historical impact to the globe.

Re: Edward Snowden’s Escape from Hong Kong [audio]

#80

Post by JumpCrisscross »

beepboopbeep wrote: post #52
georgespencer wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the most disappointing things about the last election cycle in the U.S. and Brexit here in the U.K. has been people happily accepting euphemism and hyperbole as part of political/social rhetoric. Maybe it's been happening for a while, but to me it felt like a sudden shift. Bannon is a "white supremacist" because he was accused of making a single antisemitic remark by his ex-wife, during divorce proceedings, wh…

Calling everyone and everything "Hitler" is hyperbole. Calling out behaviors, statements, and actions that align with fascism or historical precedents of fascism as such, would seem perfectly reasonable.

Within the context of fleeing a country, I think the analogy is inappropriate. Worse, it's numbing. If you're at the fleeing stage, it's too late to do anything from inside.
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