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Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

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Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#211

Post by onion2k »

symlinkk wrote: post #11
Overtonwindow wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nice video, but the evidence is not clear that was human or computer error. It would be nice to make that distinction somewhere..

There is a red light. The car, which is being driven by a computer, did not stop. That is a computer error.

which is being driven by a computer

The point is that we don't know that. It may have been under driver control at the time.

There's probably a good argument for having some sort of external indicator of whether or not a self-driving car is under computer control or human control. Maybe a small roof mounted beacon that has to be lit up or something.

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#212

Post by majewsky »

abraca wrote: post #187
teej wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you able to speak more about your specific experience?

I can't, I'm sorry. I could get some media around my story but I am a private person. Plus Uber would probably just discredit me and lie. I wish I didn't have to deal with them over the accident stuff because they fight really dirty.

It's too late now since you used your normal account here, but next time, you might want to use a throwaway account to speak more freely.

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#213

Post by return0 »

kt9 wrote: post #34
stuckagain wrote: post #3

Self-driving Uber car blows red signal at crosswalk in SF: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CdJ4oae8f4

Looks like the video was taken by a dash cam from a police car - am I reading that right? If thats true I wonder why the cop didn't pull the uber over. edit: This also leads to another question - how does a cop pull a self driving car over? Does the car know to respond to police lights? And if it does pull over then who does the cop talk to?

> And if it does pull over then who does the cop talk to?

It's going to be even funnier when the patrol car is an unmanned self-driving bot itself.

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#214

Post by metafunctor »

Shank wrote: post #202
cmurf wrote: post #174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Humans do this also. It makes me wonder what the driver did before left turn arrows were common. In driver's ed, i was tought to pull into the intersection blocking the right lane of perpendicular traffic (to my left), the lane just after the crosswalk. A surprising number of people don't pull up at all.

As a new driver, I would much, much rather play it safe if I'm unfamiliar with the intersection & traffic flow than pull out. Does it seem silly to you? Probably. To me? No. I don't want to be caught in an intersection that I'm not supposed to be in when the light turns red.

Pardon me if this sounds rude, but where did you learn to drive? I was taught in driving school that you are supposed to pull up when turning left at an intersection with lights but no left turn arrow.

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#215

Post by return0 »

stuckagain wrote: post #3

Self-driving Uber car blows red signal at crosswalk in SF: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CdJ4oae8f4

There should be special fines for self-driving cars making errors. It would force companies to be more careful and lead to better engineering. Also, competing manufacturers could "turn in" to police other manufacturer's cars that misbehave.

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#216

Post by usrusr »

notyourwork wrote: post #127
surfmike wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why wouldn't you want to give a bad rating for bad driving? I almost always give 5 stars, but with the notable exception being distracted or aggressive drivers.

I don't want to criticize you in particular but I have a problem with "always give 5 stars". Are you telling me that your average Uber ride is 100% perfect? I find that hard to believe, moreover basic distributions would find this improbable. Sorry for ranting, I wish more people would give realistic ratings to things instead of starting with 100% perfect and decrementing for misses. It should start in the middle, 50…

> Are you telling me that your average Uber ride is 100% perfect?

If you think of the service as a means of conveniently getting to a given destination and not as a performance in artfully begging for a good rating, then 100% should not be too unlikely.

Once you start giving extra points for nonessential extras, a driver who is polite and always on time will get a lower average rating than one who is 20% unreliable but hands out warm towels and free cake.

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#217

Post by dagw »

detaro wrote: post #60
jacobolus wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t have Uber installed on my phone. I mostly walk or take the bus/subway. This is just my observations as a pedestrian.

oh, then I misunderstood. Would still be curious how passengers actually act in these cases, since "I don't want to give a bad rating" seems to be a big thing.

If the behavior resulted in the passenger getting to where had to be on time, as opposed to 15 minutes late, then I'd assume they'd reward the driver for this behavior.

In fact it would be interesting to see how ride times compare between driven and driver-less Ubers. I suspect that initial results will show that driverless cars are slower and that this might make some people prefer human drivers.

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#218

Post by return0 »

Boxbot wrote: post #36
JamilD wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Updated Uber statement: "This incident was due to human error. This is why we believe so much in making the roads safer by building self-driving Ubers. This vehicle was not part of the pilot and was not carrying customers. The driver involved has been suspended while we continue to investigate." https://techcrunch.com/2016/12/14/uber-looking-into-incident...

I find it telling that they do not actually say whether the car was in autonomous mode when it ran the red light, only that it was "due to human error". Was the human error that they didn't assume manual control and stop the car?

we can only assume it was in fact in autonomous mode.

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#219

Post by majewsky »

jacobolus wrote: post #38
scarmig wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe it learned a bit too much from San Francisco drivers?

If it uses Uber drivers for training, heaven help us: I’ve seen illegal U-turns, constant double parking, reversing down 1-way streets, moving right turns through red lights, sudden stops, speeding 25+ mph over the legal limit, lane changes in intersections, lots of turning without signals, lack of proper yielding to obvious pedestrians, cyclists nearly side-swiped, etc. (Some subset of) Uber drivers are one of the w…

And then people laugh at me for taking the train. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Re: Uber ordered to stop self-driving vehicle service in San Francisco

#220

Post by eginhard »

deathanatos wrote: post #136
greglindahl wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being ready to take the helm at any time is required by law, at this point. It applies to Google's test cars, to Tesla Autopilot, etc.

Are Google's / Waymo's vehicles not steering-wheel and pedal free? E.g., go to Waymo's own site here[1], scroll to "2015 World’s first fully self-driving ride on public roads", and watch the video: they give, if I'm not mistaken, a blind man a ride in a steering-wheel-free, pedals-free autonomous vehicle on public roads, in Texas. Now, granted, the original article is about the CA DMV, but I've seen vehicles that are…

"The prototype vehicles in particular are equipped with removable steering wheels, accelerator pedals and brake pedals that allow test drivers to take over driving if desired." [1]

[1] https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:0RESYe...

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