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China’s plan to organize its society relies on ‘big data’ to rate everyone

washingtonpost.com

41–50 of 171 posts

Re: China’s plan to organize its society relies on ‘big data’ to rate everyone

#41
This is clearly a very bad direction for China in itself. Most people reading this instinctively want a "but", and this is one that I can provide that applies to China and Russia (though Russia is really much freer than China):

Western critiques of China and Russia are directed at the regime, but if the regime collapses, there is no on to criticize, but people still suffer. That is, the Western critique is not fully utilitarian: it criticizes the regime for taking measures to ensure stability, without considering the consequences of the regime losing control.

For reference, about 70 million Chinese died after the collapse of the Qing dynasty (caused in part by Western intervention, by the Opium wars), and Russian life expectancy reduced significantly during the power vacuum between the fall of communism and the rise of Putin.

This gives some background on why both countries support their governments: they want stability and strong central government because they know the alternative.

If Westerners want to adopt a moral and convincing approach to human rights in China and Russia, they need to explain how these things can exist without causing a collapse of law and order that would be worse for the ordinary citizen. This would require reigning in the CIA so that countries could loosen the reigns without fear of a color revolution or Arab spring.

Re: China’s plan to organize its society relies on ‘big data’ to rate everyone

#43

This is what the DMV does with the point system. The FBI and CIA I think also collect statistics and profile relevant individuals. The difference I guess is that most of these systems are in separate silos. The Chinese government is taking the next logical step and linking it all together. Reminds me of a quote Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn’t stop to think if they shoul…

DMV tracking whether you are driving drunk is not the same as the Chinese govt. tracking whether you praise the govt. on Facebook. > The FBI and CIA I think also collect statistics and profile relevant individuals. Citation needed (especially that they do it for everyone).

> Citation needed (especially that they do it for everyone).

1. We know that they can. If you were designing a mass survaillance system, you would store all incoming information into unique bins now, then later select on the bins of interest.

2. Three years ago I asked an ex-govt employee who would know. When I got to that exact question, he got visibly upset and abruptly ended the conversation.

Re: China’s plan to organize its society relies on ‘big data’ to rate everyone

#44

This is clearly a very bad direction for China in itself. Most people reading this instinctively want a "but", and this is one that I can provide that applies to China and Russia (though Russia is really much freer than China): Western critiques of China and Russia are directed at the regime, but if the regime collapses, there is no on to criticize, but people still suffer. That is, the Western critique is not fully…

Stability and strong central government are on opposite sides.

Re: China’s plan to organize its society relies on ‘big data’ to rate everyone

#45
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait Airbnb is gonna discriminate against me because I boycott Facebook?

Not Airbnb. Your potential hosts. Airbnb allows you to provide multiple means of proving you're reasonable. Linking your FB profile is one way. Airbnb will then show the number of friends you have. This may have changed since when I signed up years ago. It's just like your GitHub is a reputation aid when applying for a job. It's not required but what you have on there can help. EDIT: In case it isn't clear, I'm not c…

I.e. nothing near what China is doing.

Re: China’s plan to organize its society relies on ‘big data’ to rate everyone

#46
post #7
post #2

I just finished watching the Nosedive (Season 3, episode 1) from Black Mirror on Netflix, it shows a similar system. Unlike other Black Mirror episodes its quite well balanced. I would highly highly recommend watching it.

Exactly. I give you 5

2. Wasn't a meaningful encounter.

Re: China’s plan to organize its society relies on ‘big data’ to rate everyone

#47
post #2

I just finished watching the Nosedive (Season 3, episode 1) from Black Mirror on Netflix, it shows a similar system. Unlike other Black Mirror episodes its quite well balanced. I would highly highly recommend watching it.

My favorite aspect of this episode is that the main character's drastic decline in quality and ease of life that coincided with her declining rating are the exact same experiences someone with poor credit or a rap sheet would experience right this second. The rating systems, lists and records we use as a metric for access and worth are draconian as it is. Crowd sourcing it just makes it glaringly obvious with a tight feedback loop.

Re: China’s plan to organize its society relies on ‘big data’ to rate everyone

#50

This is clearly a very bad direction for China in itself. Most people reading this instinctively want a "but", and this is one that I can provide that applies to China and Russia (though Russia is really much freer than China): Western critiques of China and Russia are directed at the regime, but if the regime collapses, there is no on to criticize, but people still suffer. That is, the Western critique is not fully…

With Trump and Hillary, the community on Chinese websites are increasingly disenchanted with democracy. One high-vote answer in Zhihu, or "the Chinese Quora", claims that this election cycle has been a "great educational experience for Chinese Nationalism and Marxism". You'd be surprised how popular Trump is in China, and how much they support their Government.
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