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HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

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Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#261

Post by wernercd »

canttestthis wrote: post #239
tptacek wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This mentality seems to me to have produced reviews --- on Yelp, on Grubhub, and christ have mercy on the Apple App Store --- that are basically worthless. You can painstakingly read all the reviews and try to glean useful tidbits, but you cannot look at the overall review scores and use them to make reliable decisions.

> you cannot look at the overall review scores and use them to make reliable decisions. As I said, my review (that the printer has hard-coded planned obsolescence in place) is a fair review allowing you to make a more informed, reliable decision. It's not worth a long debate, but you're not telling me your whole argument so I don't know how to respond.

The problem comes when a small subset of unhappy users... creates a mountain of bad reviews.

"It never happened to me, or any HP printer I've ever dealt with, but I read online that..."

I'd put a 5 star review on my Samsung Note. Why? Because my phone didn't explode. Hell... my phone has been through the RINGER and it still works. Can I give it a 6 star?

But because of a small SMALL subset of users that have issues with Samsung Phones, all of a sudden there are a thousand 1 star reviews who say "they explode and kill puppies (because that's what the TV/Internet told me)"?

What percentage of iPhones were affected by Bendgate? How many reviews were from Android users who never would have bought an iPhone anyway?

There's a line and, personally, I think that it's crossed when you review something negatively for an issue you've not personally experienced.

Is HP shitty for doing this? Does Samsung need negative press for it? Should Apple have to face their issues? Of course.

But unless YOU PERSONALLY have been affected, you are just part of a mob out on a witch hunt.

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#262

Post by EdHominem »

rayiner wrote: post #181
tamana wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You think sharing honest information to help people is worse than lying for profit?

The one star rating is not an honest attempt to review the product--it's just pushing an agenda. For the vast majority of people the third-party cartridge issue is a footnote, not something meriting a one-star review.

It (the review) only concerns actual product features. No political slant, no revenge, etc. It's 100% a product review and nothing else.

Imagine test-driving two cars. On the first, a wheel falls off as you round a corner. Obviously you aren't going to buy it, but then by your logic - not having bought it - you aren't allowed to comment on it.

Also, do you really believe that someone is going to be okay with a product they buy refusing to function, just because it's a tech device? Replacing consumables, even if the consumable is high-tech, is something that even non-techies can understand. As proof, I couldn't fabricate my own tires but would be annoyed if my car wouldn't run with 3rd-party tires, despite not being a mechanic. It's rude and sociopathic, to assume others are too stupid to come to the same conclusions.

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#263

Post by EdHominem »

wernercd wrote: post #261
canttestthis wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you cannot look at the overall review scores and use them to make reliable decisions. As I said, my review (that the printer has hard-coded planned obsolescence in place) is a fair review allowing you to make a more informed, reliable decision. It's not worth a long debate, but you're not telling me your whole argument so I don't know how to respond.

The problem comes when a small subset of unhappy users... creates a mountain of bad reviews. "It never happened to me, or any HP printer I've ever dealt with, but I read online that..." I'd put a 5 star review on my Samsung Note. Why? Because my phone didn't explode. Hell... my phone has been through the RINGER and it still works. Can I give it a 6 star? But because of a small SMALL subset of users that have issues w…

So if you haven't been killed by taking counterfeit or misleading cancer-drugs you don't have a right to call out the fraud?

You don't appear to have thought this all the way through...

Of your examples, only HP intended to make a crappy product. Apple and Samsung tried to make a better one (thinner, more battery life, etc) and just made some mistakes. Mistakes deserve pointing out, intentional dishonesty does deserve a witch-hunt. Every day you don't point this out to non-technical people is a day the scammers get rich from their scams.

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#264

Post by colejohnson66 »

michaelt wrote: post #252
colejohnson66 wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not without purpose though. It does it because printing all four colors ("registration") instead of just black makes for a deeper black (if that makes sense). However, you don't want to use 100% registration for text as it can easily eat up your ink/toner. A good compromise if you need deeper blacks is 100% K with a bit of CMY (don't know the percentage). I'm not discarding the idea that printer companies do it…

If you need some inks other than black to make black, why aren't they in the black ink already?

Sometimes you don't want rich blacks, and it's easier to just use some of the CMY instead of having multiple K rollers.

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#265

Post by tluyben2 »

jpna66dd wrote: post #93
tluyben2 wrote: post #50

Not trolling, but why do you use printers? I haven't used paper for 5 odd years now. The gov here (Spain) gives me tons of paper; I photograph it and then leave it and have them print it out when needed. Outside that I have not needed paper since the ipad. Why do other people?

Doing business: get paperwork, print paperwork, sign it, scan it, email it back.

Yes, but that is one printer for my company of 400+ people. It seems people are buying a lot more printers than just that.

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#266

Post by hlandau »

sly010 wrote: post #186

Here is a (probably worthless) idea: Create 1 or 2 good, serviceable network printer and experiment with different business models like subscriptions or pay-as-you-print, where the printer manufacturer _owns_ the printer an office or home just rents it. In such a model, the companies incentives would align with the users values: - Cheaper printing per page - Less overhead on distribution - No artificial costs and lim…

Another possibility is still to sell printers, but have the cartridges produced by a completely separate company. Have the cartridges also conform to an open, published specification which any company (printer maker or cartridge maker) is free to implement. The printer maker will be forced to sell printers based on their cost, not as a loss leader.

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#267

Post by Spooky23 »

wildmusings wrote: post #164
Spooky23 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tesla is already doing this, iirc. As self-driving cars become a thing, you'll see way more of this, "for safety".

In the case of automated multi-ton death machines moving at high-speed near other people, that seems totally reasonable. You shouldn't be allowed to tinker with your automated car and risk everyone else's lives.

If part of the deal with getting the car is full manufacturer liability insurance, sure. Otherwise, fuck them.

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#268

Post by qilo »

josefresco wrote: post #74

Not sure if it was a time bomb, but HP does have an "auto update" feature that could seem like a time bomb. We got nailed by this with our HP 8610. Were using 3rd party cartridges with much success for months. Last week my wife had a huge (for us) print job and encountered an annoying bug (prints blank sheets every other print). Updated the firmware hoping it would fix the problem. Next thing we know, cartridge error…

There is a firmware upgrade for this model on HP site: version R1547A from Mar 22, 2016. There wasn't new firmware releases on September 13, it's the date hardcoded into previously released firmwares as the date when to activate this "feature".

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#269

Post by csomar »

flyinghamster wrote: post #91
froh42 wrote: post #71

Such behaviour is the reason I threw out a perfectly working HP OfficeJet one day and will never buy a single HP printer in my life. In the OfficeJet in question I only used genuine cartridges, but every few year it would stop receiving black and white faxes because (the nearly full) color cartidge was passing its expiry date - forcing me to throw away the full color cartridge and buying a new one.

Join the club. At my office we had an OfficeJet, and it "expired" a printhead. It won't even allow you to SCAN unless the printhead is replaced. No more HP for me. Never again.

I had this exact same problem with Epson too. It's a general practice in this industry.

Re: HP Allegedly Time Bombs Unofficial Ink Cartridges from Working in Its Printers

#270

Post by dreamcompiler »

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #79

As an aside, does anyone remember the last time they were happy with ANY HP product? Everytime I see that logo I get chills knowing what a pain in the ass it's going to be. Edit: I am specifically thinking about HPSM, and HPNA here.

I have several BC (Before Carly) HP products that are rock solid marvels of engineering. Everything AC is a rotten piece of junk. The company now called "HP" is an impostor; it's a sad ghoulish potemkin shadow of a once-great company.
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