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Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

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81–90 of 97 posts

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#81
post #78

Question: How can it possibly be illegal to get together with others to bargain? What is the rationale? If I and my fellow students/etc want to boycott something, compare notes on pay, share legal actions, or protest shouldn't that be protected by law? I'm not a fan of unions or political parties but it blows my mind that the legality of organizing with others is even a question.

I think unions involve a lot more than that. (Correct me if I'm wrong.) For instance, the decisions a union makes or negotiates for may affect all other workers even if they aren't part of the union.

OK, that make sense.

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also true for Scandinavian countries (and trivially true for the UK). I would guess most of Europe, really. But you probably need to learn a small bit of the local language just to shop for groceries etc. The country I would be most hesitant about is France, they really don't like speaking English, and most French PhD theses are still written in French. This is really idiotic, all it does is slow down the dis…

This is only partly true, but even then, I wouldn't it call it idiotic. After all, can you defend your thesis in the US in French? You can't. So, why would it be idiotic for the French to expect theses at their unis to be defended in French, which is btw also an international language? It is not very pragmatic, for sure, but it has sense.

After all, can you defend your thesis in the US in French? You can't. So, why would it be idiotic for the French to expect theses at their unis to be defended in French

Because English is the lingua franca of most academic fields? If you are publishing in English conference proceedings and journals, isn't it reasonable to write your thesis in English as well?

(Note that English is the default language of theses in many European countries.)

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#83
post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Athletics are a profit center for only a few universities. I doubt though that this includes spending on stadiums. There is also the cost in terms of corruption of the university and the damage done to athletes (especially American football) for little to no compensation. http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/media-center/news/athlet...

They're also only a profit center if there are other universities willing to make a loss. If those universities decided to stop spending on athletics then the profitable ones would soon find their profits disappear. Taken as a whole, the college athletics industry is an overall negative sum for education. Looking at it from the perspective of an individual college misses the big picture.

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Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#84

At the University of Oregon it seems almost a yearly occurrence that grad students strike, usually a week or two before finals need to be graded. I'm apathetic to the ordeal because whether its administrators, professors, or grad students, getting payed, I'm still stuck paying an egregious tuition. That said in every department except for the Math department both professors and GTFs (graduate-teaching-fellows) have b…

Egregious? http://financialaid.oregonstate.edu/review_costofattendance

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#85
post #51
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who said a grad student gets benefits? At my college at least, grad students are basically students with - if they're lucky - a stipend and a tuition waiver.

A student can buy into a group insurance plan, whereas a contract worker cannot.

Oh I see, thanks for the info.

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends. Are the grad students making six-figure incomes while they suffer through the experience, as the startup employees do?

They are not. But are startup employees doing something meaningful, or building their own reputations and expertise? And since you're talking about software startup employees, probably the closest comparison is CS phd students, who are nowhere near suffering. The vast majority of graduate students are at least as satisfied as a developer, otherwise whole programs would have disappeared decades ago from inability to r…

There's a lot of variation, both due to school and due to department. When I did my PhD, I found the Biosciences department to be rather brutal. Drinking and misery poker (and Magic the Gathering) were the standard pastimes, and long, tedious hours were the norm. On the other hand, the CS department was much more laid back, with much more time put into 'cerebral' work. It's not that the CS students were smarter, I knew a number of brilliant biologists, but the nature of subject matter and the culture. Biology experiments are inherently physical, and can fail or die if not attended to properly, putting a pretty tight time constraint on the experimenter. CS work is much more forgiving, and much more of it (proportionally) happens in the mind. Biology is also a much more grind-centered culture, perhaps in part because it lacks a strong history of internal tool building, while tedious work in CS tends to inspire attempts to build automation and higher level methods. I think some of this is the difficulty (tools in Biology are just harder to make), and some of this is purely culture. I would argue that the somewhat bizarre field of Biophysics is, historically speaking, the tooling culture of Biology that was severed off when Molecular Biology became a field in it's own right and the tools were commoditized, and it's partially this split that's responsible for the culture there.

All of which is to say, grad school is horrible. Sometimes. Sometimes it's awesome, and YMMV.

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most PhDs in Netherlands accept English speakers, and they all have many international students. When you find a position advertized, you can ask them about the procedure for non-EU citizens.

This is also true for Scandinavian countries (and trivially true for the UK). I would guess most of Europe, really. But you probably need to learn a small bit of the local language just to shop for groceries etc. The country I would be most hesitant about is France, they really don't like speaking English, and most French PhD theses are still written in French. This is really idiotic, all it does is slow down the dis…

The last academic institute I worked for (in Spain) was started by people from a French institute. Mix of nationalities and they all spoke English well.

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#88
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Academics spend a lot of time on the internet defending their poor decision of going into academia, as well as anyone who points out how obviously fruitless academia is. For most people it's nearly impossible to admit something they just dedicated a large portion of their life too was completely worthless. (standard disclaimer statement that of course there are exceptions to the trend.)

Sure if your only goal is to make money...I am a CS PhD and at least in this area, believe it or not, I really haven't met many academics who regretted their choices.

[deleted]

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is only partly true, but even then, I wouldn't it call it idiotic. After all, can you defend your thesis in the US in French? You can't. So, why would it be idiotic for the French to expect theses at their unis to be defended in French, which is btw also an international language? It is not very pragmatic, for sure, but it has sense.

After all, can you defend your thesis in the US in French? You can't. So, why would it be idiotic for the French to expect theses at their unis to be defended in French Because English is the lingua franca of most academic fields? If you are publishing in English conference proceedings and journals, isn't it reasonable to write your thesis in English as well? (Note that English is the default language of theses in ma…

Lingua Franca literally means The Language of the Franks, ie French language (pun intended)...

Re: Graduate Students, the Laborers of Academia

#90

it should be written as "Cheap Labor". I can vouch this as I went to graduate school where I worked for 5 years at 8-10 hours/day including Saturday and Sunday for $12,000/year to get a PhD in Biological Science. And it was in one of the most expensive state in US. So could not afford to start a family because of perpetual state of sharing apartment and not enough money and time to go out and find a partner. And at t…

My wife went to a #1/#2 school for her field (molecular cell bio.) It certainly didn't seem much better there.

I agree it may not when compared to a top school for MBA or Computer Science. Still it opens more opportunity such as consulting in Big 3 or your boss has more contacts in pharma industry so there is a chance you will get some entry level opportunity in big pharma or biotech startups. But if you are from a middle tier state univ where you boss do research on "sleeping habit of frog or pink fluffly bunnies" then you are out of luck.
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