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Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

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Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#291

Post by Nadya »

andrepd wrote: post #257
mikegerwitz wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The term "piracy" doesn't help the problems any---it's a smear term that tries to put downloading and sharing on the same level as murder and kidnapping. https://torrentfreak.com/mpaa-banned-from-using-piracy-and-t... . I prefer the term "sharing". As you mention, intent is not always to avoid paying. Some people may want backups, may have lost their copy after paying for it, may be frustrated by DRM-laced copies tha…

>As you mention, intent is not always to avoid paying. Yeah, not always, but very often. Everyone here is trying to downplay this, but I would say >80% of people (disclamer: pulled from my behind) torrent simply because it's free and if they can easily obtain it free rather than paying, then they will. The argument that people pirate because the paid options are shit, and if they were as convenient as torrents people…

>The argument that people pirate because the paid options are shit, and if they were as convenient as torrents people would just pay for them, is rendered moot with the Steam counterexample.

Steam is usually used as the example of how better distribution results in less pirating...but not all games are available through Steam or "as easily" obtained as through Steam.

Netflix is also a good example. Most people I knew who used PTP were:

1) In regions Netflix doesn't support or doesn't "properly" support (see: UK above)

2) Watching movies that weren't even available through Netflix.

With the death of "game demos" I pirate most of my games. I also purchase most of those games. If game demos were such a thing - the games I did not purchase were games I'd never have bought. Which is very consistent with the "typical pirate argument of trying to make themselves feel righteous".

There are (of course) people who will download for free because they can but the pirates who actually talk about pirating seem to always have other, "reasonable" motives. Bypassing DRM limitations, removing ads, to demo something/see if it is worth paying for, or because pirating is the only way to even obtain the material. They don't even have the option of paying for it if they wanted to.

How could pirating hurt sales if the person pirating can't even purchase the damn thing?

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#292

Post by digler999 »

rpgmaker wrote: post #284
lewisl9029 wrote: post #277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everyone here is trying to downplay this, but I would say >80% of people (disclamer: pulled from my behind) torrent simply because it's free and if they can easily obtain it free rather than paying, then they will. The argument that people pirate because the paid options are shit, and if they were as convenient as torrents people would just pay for them, is rendered moot with the Steam counterexample. Content distr…

> There is also the argument that a large portion of those people would never have paid for your content in the first place So? If you make a product you usually pay a lot of attention to price it in a way that your target market can afford. The people that can't pay for it aren't supposed to get it for "free" (if you everyone accepted this logic capitalism as we know it would crumble). I say this as someone who pira…

capitalism wouldn't "crumble" if people who had no need for a product happened to have possession of it. If I had a free tugboat in my back yard, that does't alter the market for tugboat operators in any nearby port.

I thought that it has been economically proven that digital goods such as mp3 downloads have zero value, since each additional copy costs the manufacturer 0.

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#293

Post by Freak_NL »

Zombieball wrote: post #268
Freak_NL wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that there is an explanation for this geoblocking doesn't mean that we aren't being treated differently. Fortunately, Netflix is putting a lot of effort in their own content to prevent exactly this quagmire of regional licensing. They are well aware that it is one of the biggest complaints their customers have. Oddly enough, the new Star Trek series will actually be on Netflix worldwide except for North Amer…

> usually it is only the other way around except for the local-language content. I personally don't think this is true. There are significant amounts of content on Netflix that are only available in regions such as NLD and GBR that are not available in USA / CAN (Orphan Black comes to mind off the top of my head). The problem definitely goes both ways.

   USA: 4100 films, 1154 series
   Netherlands: 1475 films, 382 series¹
It really doesn't compare. In the US Netflix works as a back catalogue for older films as well. Sure, not everything is there, but compared to what we get…

1: http://unogs.com/countrydetail/

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#294

Post by Nullabillity »

6clotr1ckg wrote: post #272
Nullabillity wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the very least, Sweden[1] and Denmark[2] have systems that pad out your student loans with government grants that apply to (almost) everyone. [1]: http://www.csn.se/en/2.1034/2.1036/2.1037/2.1038 [2]: http://www.su.dk/english/

US has that too, it's called the Pell Grant.

> Federal Pell Grants are limited to students with financial need, who have not earned their first bachelor's degree, or who are enrolled in certain post-baccalaureate programs, through participating institutions.[1]

CSN money is not conditional based on your family's income, has no relationship with the military, and is not earmarked for any particular purpose. The only requirements are that you can't get more than 6 years total (a relatively recent restriction), that you pass 75% of your courses, and that you don't personally earn more than ~160k SEK/year (the exact amount varies, but has an inverse proportion to how much your study).

During high school you get a smaller amount, but then it's only conditional on attendance, not your academic results.

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#295

Post by Freak_NL »

KenM wrote: post #254
Freak_NL wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> mouses Mice. :)

It's not really set in stone, from here[0], for instance - "Technically, since "mouse" is an acronym for "manually-operated user-select equipment," it could probably be pluralized as "mouses." But since hardly anyone is aware of the word's etymology, and because it sounds less awkward, most people pluralize it as "mice."" [0] - http://painintheenglish.com/case/534

You are correct when talking about computer mice/mouses, but for the animal referred to here (figuratively) the plural is mice.

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#296

Post by josho »

tempestn wrote: post #283
josho wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In this thread why are the rental options like iTunes not being discussed? Those distribution channels have the convenience of streaming, and a deep catalog. Is it because everyone wants all the movies for $10/mth or less rather than $5 a show?

I'm honestly not that familiar with iTunes' offerings. $5 for a new release movie rental sounds ok if the selection is there.

Yeh, iTunes and similar options have a pretty good selection, in both SD and HD. It doesn't suffer from the same pains that DVDs had (ie. no advertisements before the movie starts). It is more convenient than torrenting.

So, it strikes me as odd that people here only consider pre-pay streaming options and ignore other viable options as they rant about their rationalization for torrents.

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#297

Post by josho »

adrusi wrote: post #205
josho wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sharing is just as bad as pirating. Let's call it what it is. Copyright infringement.

It is copyright infringement, but calling it that carries moral stigma, even though "copyright infringement" has no actual ethical meaning, only a legal one. What you're saying is akin to entering a conversation about the value of cannabis and saying "Let's just call it what it is. Criminal production, distribution and possession of a controlled substance".

I find your perspective interesting. When I mention copyright infringement to friends I get blank stares. So, my experience is that the term has no stigma, people simply don't understand what it means.

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#298

Post by intended »

It's amazing that even on HN, the conversation is no longer moored to the past.

Copyright in America has been extended beyond reasonable restriction, driven by the MPAA and RIAA who began chipping away at the net as we knew it, and continue to do so today. All of this at the behest of firms which continue to use the most interesting of accounting techniques to show losses, while simultaneously doing everything in their power to make it harder for people to comfortably and easily access media (starting from the time of CDs to today).

All this on top of the fact that studies show that torrenting movies don't indicate lost sales and actually working as a signal to indicate the popularity of a product.

all this on the forum where it's reasonable to expect people to know the value of the network effect.

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#299

Post by alanwatts »

youngButEager wrote: post #285

GOOD RIDDANCE. The example of Zuckerberg stealing the idea for Facebook and getting rich has contributed to the foolish belief that it's okay to "enjoy the benefit of something that was SUPPOSED to be paid for -- and NOT PAYING". "I didn't steal any copyrighted material, my site just helped people who WANTED to enjoy the benefit of copyrighted material that was SUPPOSED to be paid for but didn't pay. So I'm in the cl…

All that's left is for us to ban roads, that way no one can drive their get away cars.

Re: Torrentz Shuts Down, Largest Torrent Meta-Search Engine Says Farewell

#300

Post by intended »

Noos wrote: post #252
Karunamon wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Copyright infringement is to artists as H1-B Visa abuse is to programmers. Both make it harder to earn a living and depress wages/destroy jobs in their respective fields. See, here's the biggest problem with "copyright infringement" as a term; it's too broad. It covers $random_co using your stuff commercially, but it also covers your gran downloading songs from sketchy websites in Russia. I don't think even the most…

It's not unambiguous. If enough grannies decide to pirate goods (edit), the effect is the same, or if anything worse because they are distributed and impossible to stop, where as repurposers can be at least targeted. If you own a physical goods store, shrink is shrink...a professional thievery team vs 100 grannies and kids shoplifting results in the same loss, but if anything, it's easier to watch out for and stop th…

What loss? Was the granny going to pay for it all?

Do note that the same people who were pirating games/movies i Decades ago are now making them or buying them.

Not to mention that There's more content to consume today - for free, than there is to buy.

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