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What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

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Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#231
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they aren't supported by the state, they are supported by their families.

I don't see how that's a relevant response to my comment, as it doesn't answer my question. It's not really a matter of public policy, unless you're suggesting we some how legally prevent people from supporting family members who aren't working.

I think the implied answer here is you increase taxes, thereby funding the jobs for unemployed people and also making it harder for families to afford to support the unemployed.

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#232
post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A friend's mother worked in a high-level consulting agency. Her time was billed out at $1000/hour, and she got less than 10% of that. Still a good wage, but she wasn't getting the lion's share of the fee.

If she was being temped out for $1000, she could hang out her own shingle and charge $500.

Sometimes the only way to do such "expensive" work requires significant support. Things like their legal protection against liability, mandatory requirements to have X to do Y in a jurisdiction, and other sorts of things can really eat into the revenue of a small business or sole trader.

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If she was being temped out for $1000, she could hang out her own shingle and charge $500.

Sometimes the only way to do such "expensive" work requires significant support. Things like their legal protection against liability, mandatory requirements to have X to do Y in a jurisdiction, and other sorts of things can really eat into the revenue of a small business or sole trader.

Exactly. The trick to billing $1000/hr is finding someone who'll pay it, and having the connections to get in front of them, and their trust that its $1000/hr well spent, which entails no small amount of theatrics on the part of a corporate shield.

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's like saying there's plenty of room for musicians if you're Mozart. The amount of investment required to develop yourself for a target field has grown astronomically, but that's been coupled with a push down in wages. I know lawyers who spent a fortune for their degree, passed the Bar, and make barely more than minimum wage. Regulation isn't causing this; automation is causing this.

There is no robot that can knock me out (safely so that I wake up when everything is done), snake a thing down my windpipe, poke through the exact right spot in my bronchial tube and into my mediastinum (a name for the bag that my heart), and retrieve a chunk of whatever surrounds my aorta. But here I wait, while people capable of doing this (or at least capable of learning how to do it - and that's a lot of people)…

There now is a robot that can knock you out safely

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/new-machine-...

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#235
post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've had this suspicion that I've been meaning to look into to find out if the numbers match up. The biggest growing industries to me seem to be the service industry and entertainment. Both of these are really superfluous. If is true, I see this as a symptom that we have fewer useful jobs and are pushing people into these superfluous jobs--kind of a sign that soon we'll have more people than jobs. More to your case,…

So why if there's demand for certain jobs, why there aren't more programs to train more of them. Medicare (i.e., the federal government, congress) sets de facto limits on the number of new residents that are trained each year. "The Balanced Budget Refinement Act of 1999 (BBRA) increased the limit for rural teaching hospitals to equal 130% of each rural teaching hospital's 1996 resident count (BBRA Section 407)." http…

I do wish that was brought up. However, government provided healthcare or not (and Medicare or not), I think healthcare should be closely regulated (maybe by professional organizations if not the government). I can't find the citation, but I was reading that as doctor density increases, the number of procedures increase even though the outcomes are the same. It's also pretty obvious that as Baby Boomers start retiring, we're going to need more medical professionals. The demand for those services probably won't show up until it's too late to train them so it'd be good to incentivise people now (although, it might be too late already).

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no robot that can knock me out (safely so that I wake up when everything is done), snake a thing down my windpipe, poke through the exact right spot in my bronchial tube and into my mediastinum (a name for the bag that my heart), and retrieve a chunk of whatever surrounds my aorta. But here I wait, while people capable of doing this (or at least capable of learning how to do it - and that's a lot of people)…

One can visualize a future in which disposable robots are very small and remotely controlled, capable of liquefying specific organic substances or dispensing drug doses.

I had two reactions to your comment. One, in which I assume you meant it in a way that was optimistic and benign. Two, in which it described a Matrix-like dystopia.

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#237
post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the one hand you argue for a free market approach (less regulations and hence more doctors) but then you also argue for a meritocracy (those who work and think should get priority). Both of these are definitely not democratic, and for the time being democracies are the preeminent social construct with massive momentum behind them. Changing that abruptly would be seriously destabilizing for the entire world.

Changing that abruptly would be seriously destabilizing for the entire world. You're absolutely right about this point, which is why benefits need to be removed over time. (People that have expected a Social Security check, and have paid into it their entire lives can't be expected to react just as they reach retirement. However, a 25-year-old can be told, "save for your own retirement, because this won't be there fo…

Disingenuously left out of your arguments here is the fact that a medical education costs a hell of a lot of money, and your economic measures would remove the ability to study medicine from a lot of people who might be willing to learn, but don't have massively rich parents. Deregulating university fees, getting rid of social security, and so fourth massively reduces the number of people who are able to study medicine.

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#238
post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the one hand you argue for a free market approach (less regulations and hence more doctors) but then you also argue for a meritocracy (those who work and think should get priority). Both of these are definitely not democratic, and for the time being democracies are the preeminent social construct with massive momentum behind them. Changing that abruptly would be seriously destabilizing for the entire world.

Changing that abruptly would be seriously destabilizing for the entire world. You're absolutely right about this point, which is why benefits need to be removed over time. (People that have expected a Social Security check, and have paid into it their entire lives can't be expected to react just as they reach retirement. However, a 25-year-old can be told, "save for your own retirement, because this won't be there fo…

The problem with SS is that if the 25 year olds don't keep paying, there's no money to give to the 75 year olds who paid their whole working life. The money THEY contributed is long ago spent.

It's much harder to tell the 25 year olds to keep paying FICA and save for their own retirement.

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Changing that abruptly would be seriously destabilizing for the entire world. You're absolutely right about this point, which is why benefits need to be removed over time. (People that have expected a Social Security check, and have paid into it their entire lives can't be expected to react just as they reach retirement. However, a 25-year-old can be told, "save for your own retirement, because this won't be there fo…

Disingenuously left out of your arguments here is the fact that a medical education costs a hell of a lot of money, and your economic measures would remove the ability to study medicine from a lot of people who might be willing to learn, but don't have massively rich parents. Deregulating university fees, getting rid of social security, and so fourth massively reduces the number of people who are able to study medici…

Disingenuously left out of your arguments here

First, this is way out of line. I'm going to reply anyway, but please don't do this kind of thing in your next reply.

Second, instead of treating it like a black box that has a fixed cost that we have to accept, take a medical education apart the way Musk would do when figuring the ultimate cost of one his cars or rockets:

Putting people in a room, books in their hands, and having them sit in front of a lecturer is not actually that expensive. I won't name names, but two medical students I knew in the last fifteen years actually skipped most of their lectures, studied straight out of the book and did just fine.

It is true that the hands-on aspect of medical training is more expensive, but people in much poorer countries manage to do it.

Even if you managed to show that this education outlined above is inferior to the ones available today, right now I'd still be overjoyed to see a doctor educated in this manner. It's better than waiting two months (note that this is not even for treatment - it's just a biopsy!) while I can feel this thing getting bigger, with sharper pain as time goes on.

Finally, what is the point here? An more economically "equal" society, or a society where people like me don't die waiting in line for care? I stridently advocate for the latter.

Re: What If There Just Aren’t Enough Jobs to Go Around?

#240
post #76

People forget History. The two times where labor was more valuable than capital. 1 | After the black death in Europe 2 | After the second world war Most of history's default was the gilded age, the roman empire survived for 600[1] years with having worse inequality than in the modern times. Usually the only way to reverse the trend is by a large scale elimination of significant portion of young people. [1] EDIT : cor…

Roman Empire only lasted around 600 years, years -27 to 565. Roman Republic lasted slightly shorter that 500 years. You must me mistaking it for Egypt of pharaoh times.

It lasted in the East until 1453.
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