Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric • Hacker News Board

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#91

Post by davidf18 » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 4:31 PM UTC

SyneRyder wrote: post #75

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He doesn't even mention a friend having a broken mac, I think you miss-parsed; or maybe I did. "this" mac broke, not "his"?? Certainly you summary is wrong as a synopsis of his comment.

That's correct - by "this" Mac I meant the one I'm typing on now. It works at the moment, but it has twice lost the startup drive & refused to start without new replacement components from Apple - not something I expect from brand new hardware bought direct from Apple.

Very sorry to hear that you're having problems. Macs have had problems with GPUs in the past in Macbook Pros (2011 version?) where Apple has ended up replacing the entire insides (this happened recently on a friends 17" 2011).

But (knock on aluminum), I've had 4 macs since 2011 all without hardware problems.

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#92

Post by davidf18 » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 4:35 PM UTC

brudgers wrote: post #81

tedunangst wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You couldn't buy any laptop of any quality for $700 in 2000. Macs have the reputation of being overpriced, but they are much more affordable than computers at the turn of the century. Of course, PCs are still available for less, but the point is that many people previously unable to afford a Mac can.

Reminds me of buying the Toshiba Satellite 1805-s201 in August 2001. It was the first sub $1000 laptop I saw: $995 with $100 manufacturer rebate. Celeron 800 mhz, 128mb, and 20GB of spinning rust. It was the cheapest laptop and ran the current version AutoCAD without a problem [actually, ADT2 which had a much higher load than typical AutoCAD]. To me, the way to weigh value is relative to workload. Few users are hardw…

Around that time, I would buy "refurbished" Thinkpads around Canal Street in NYC (where many cheap things are sold) from an authorized dealer for much lower than the regular price.

The "refurbished" were generally returns that were reinspected, etc. The company bought a lot of them.

But to have only spent $700 for a 13" Macbook Air type of machine then! :-)

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#93

Post by paulmd » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 5:05 PM UTC

zerr wrote: post #16

yoavm wrote: post #4

Personally I find it very odd. I've been a Linux-only user for the past 13 years, and Windows 10 was the first time I actually considered trying Windows as my main OS. I guess our metrics are different.

Similarly, but for me it was Vista. I'm still on Win7 until MS comes up with "better 7", nothing so far...

8.1 is better than 7. 10 is better than 8.1 Both simply require ClassicShell to be installed; the actual underlying OS kernel is actually faster and more stable.

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#94

Post by paulmd » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 5:07 PM UTC

ams6110 wrote: post #36

vblord wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows 10 is awesome. Everyone I know was excited to upgrade. I think it's much better than Win 7. I think you'll like it.

From a usability standpoint, Windows 10 is nice. Do check compatibility before upgrading. My middle-aged Dell Precision laptop with Windows 7 sticker does not officially support Windows 10 according to Dell. It runs Windows 10 OK but I do get the occasional blue-screen panic from the wireless network interface driver.

Like any major OS upgrade, you are better off with a clean install rather than an upgrade. Let the installer run and activate, and then use a boot disk to nuke the system and install a fresh copy.

I had a few minor twitches like that too, and they've all gone away after doing a clean install.

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#95

Post by Sylos » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 5:09 PM UTC

cptskippy wrote: post #78

SeanDav wrote: post #58

Ironically, Windows 10 is probably the Microsoft OS that is going to push me full time to using Linux. Right now I use Linux for work, but home network, and laptops (except 1 Mac) all run on Windows 7/8. However the underhanded tactics that Microsoft have resorted to in order to try force me to upgrade and the fact that I lose significant (actually all) control on patching, worries about MS spyware etc means that Win…

This false rhetoric is really getting old. The double standards, holding MS to a higher standard than everyone else, and the ignoring of reality really make it hard to sympathize with the one valid argument you actually have.

Are you sure you replied to the right comment? I can neither see false rhetoric nor any form of double standard in the parent. Otherwise, please do explain what you mean with that.

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#96

Post by WayneBro » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 5:15 PM UTC

plandis wrote: post #56

noxToken wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I plan on test driving 10 this weekend. From what I've heard (installation tactics aside), it seems like Win10 is a better Win7. What about it doesn't make it a better Win7? Edit: Clarification.

My favorite part is the forced upgrades. Didn't want to reboot your computer? WELL TOO BAD MICROSOFT KNOWS BEST.

They're hardly forced. I disabled automatic updates via a Group Policy setting. Here are the instructions for the Pro version of Windows:

1. Run `gpedit.msc`.

2. Navigate to Computer Configuration\Administrative Templates\Windows Components\Windows Update.

3. Locate the “Configure Automatic Updates” setting in the right pane and double-click it. Set it to “Enabled,” and then select your preferred setting. For example, you can choose “Auto download and notify for install” or “Notify for download and notify for install.” Save the change.

If you're running Windows 10 Home you can simply set your ethernet/wifi connection as a metered connection which results in the same exact policy being applied - you get to choose when to install updates...

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#97

Post by WayneBro » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 5:24 PM UTC

izzydata wrote: post #59

jasonkostempski wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Your files are exactly where you left them" I found something very HALish about that screen. A vague somewhat reassuring statement with an ominous tone. I mean, great, they're right where I left them but will you grant me access them?

The sad thing about that screen is when you login only discover windows has uninstalled some of your software.

I've experienced more loss of data and programs when upgrading minor versions of Android, iOS and OS X than I ever have upgrading to Windows 10, which is running on no less than seven computers in my house.

My wife upgraded her laptop and the TV/Kodi computer that I built for her on her own. She's an elementary school teacher and by no means is she a computer professional. It wasn't scary at all. She didn't lose anything and she has a LOT of apps on her laptop.

If she had lost something, it wouldn't have been lost for long because A) we had backups and B) when Windows removes a program during an upgrade, it doesn't remove all of the app data so at worst you have to run an installer...big deal.

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#98

Post by cptskippy » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 6:56 PM UTC

Sylos wrote: post #95

cptskippy wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This false rhetoric is really getting old. The double standards, holding MS to a higher standard than everyone else, and the ignoring of reality really make it hard to sympathize with the one valid argument you actually have.

Are you sure you replied to the right comment? I can neither see false rhetoric nor any form of double standard in the parent. Otherwise, please do explain what you mean with that.

Why is my responsibility to explain how the OP is lying rather than for him to justify his lies? I would ask you to explain to me how the OP's statements are true. The only truth in the OP's original statement was regarding the Windows 10 upgrade program. Everything else is FUD.

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#99

Post by NobleSir » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 7:34 PM UTC

sickbeard wrote: post #67

NobleSir wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>given up on mobile I don't know about that, they sure have been pushing a lot of new builds lately : https://www.reddit.com/domain/blogs.windows.com/search?q=bui... though I guess they did sell part of Nokia or something.. Sad because those phones are super durable for someone like me who breaks devices constantly

They gave up by not mentioning it even once at the last BUILD. That's when even as a dev, I realized the platform had been virtually abandoned.

Well, I wasn't there so idk about that, but it looks like 3/7 of the "most important announcements of build 2016" are directly related to windows 10 mobile ^[1]

1. "Microsoft is launching its latest version of Windows 10"

(you realize this is for pc and mobile?)

3. "Facebook committed to bringing native apps to Microsoft's Universal Windows Platform"

7. "Windows 10 Mobile users will be able to "beam" Continuum sessions to compatible monitors."

The point I take from this is that they seem to be considering windows 10 as one platform (desktop and mobile), which makes sense to me since the several apps I've written for UWP worked on mobile/desktop with the same code. Also I think the react-native-windows news isn't listed there, but I personally consider it fairly huge news for win 10 mobile (and desktop) as someone who uses react-native for android / ios

[1] http://www.windowscentral.com/most-important-announcements-b...

Re: Windows 10 a failure by Microsoft's own metric

#100

Post by SeanDav » Mon, Jul 18, 2016, 8:50 PM UTC

cptskippy wrote: post #98

Sylos wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you sure you replied to the right comment? I can neither see false rhetoric nor any form of double standard in the parent. Otherwise, please do explain what you mean with that.

Why is my responsibility to explain how the OP is lying rather than for him to justify his lies? I would ask you to explain to me how the OP's statements are true. The only truth in the OP's original statement was regarding the Windows 10 upgrade program. Everything else is FUD.

FUD you say?

Please explain how one can permanently or even significantly delay a security update in Windows 10 Home and Professional? While one generally wants security updates, there are time when one does not. There could be something in the new patch that clashes with some hardware combinations and a new patch could render my machine unusable.

As far as privacy and data protection, here are some quotes from a recent article in pcadvisor.com:

http://www.pcadvisor.co.uk/feature/windows/should-i-upgrade-...

> "After writing this article in June 2015 before Windows 10 was released, there was quite the backlash from people who felt that their privacy was being invaded by Windows 10, and rightfully so. Not only is Microsoft now urging people to upgrade to Windows 10, but it's almost forcing them.

The reason appears to be data harvesting. Windows 10 collects a variety of data, some for improving the effectiveness of features such as Cortana. There are ways (as you can see below), even before installing Windows 10 to disable most of these features and prevent your information from being captured in the first place."

> "By switching them off, you'll have more privacy, but how much more data Microsoft is collecting is anyone's guess. We certainly can't say that you can prevent 100 percent of your data from being sent to Microsoft, but it's safe to say that Windows 10 does have the most data harvesting of any version of Windows yet. By switching them off, you'll have more privacy, but how much more data Microsoft is collecting is anyone's guess. We certainly can't say that you can prevent 100 percent of your data from being sent to Microsoft, but it's safe to say that Windows 10 does have the most data harvesting of any version of Windows yet."